Nominet shambles

[Lovekraft]

I have actually begun to think that encouraging anyone and everyone to become A Nominet member and Registrar is not necessarily the best way forward. Being a Nominet Registrar does and rightly should require a higher level of expertise than being just a Registrant. Do you agree or disagree on that?

It's not rocket science, i've worked with registrar tags and their control panels for many years in the past but thanks for trying to make it sound like you need a degree in registrar account holding to apply for membership.

 

[Lovekraft]

Daily.co.uk for example charge £2.55 + VAT per year when one purchases 1000 of their 2-10 year *.uk domain credits in bulk. Each credit is worth 1 year but one needs to use a minimum of 2 credits at a time (either for registration or renewal). That's 10p above wholesale based on a 2 year registration or renewal, at the moment. The outlay is £2550 + VAT for 500 X 2 year registrations or renewals and free DNS included (won't get that going direct to Nominet).

1000 X £0.10 = £100 above wholesale price to go with Daily. Consider the start up cost and annual cost of going directly with Nominet and assume Daily have a fantastic UI and offer free transfers, for a moment (I've no idea). Where's the benefit to get involved directly with Nominet unless you want to drop catch?

Because Daily don't offer free registrant transfers?

 

[Lovekraft]

I don't know your capabilities so no need to take offence. It is actually supposed to require a higher level of understanding to become a Registrar. It used to be even more involved when it was Automaton (PGP signed emails only). However it is also an economic decision and looking at the Daily prices I've listed, it obviously doesn't make economic sense to do it in many respects.

It's been a while, i only remember using it alongside the Automaton rather than without but with the right PGP client it was pretty straight forward. I didn't even realise that wasn't required now so can't understand why you are making it sound like some complex task to act as a registrar, especially on a basic self managed basis for an individual.

I think the points made about the simplicity of the transfer process as a registrar is one of the main benefits for becoming a member.

Also it would be nice to have that extra level of control and security over my own portfolio. And i don't particularly want to pre purchase 1000 credits with 1 registrar before i can begin to make the same savings as being a member.

 

[Lovekraft]

I haven't checked whether Daily are an Accredited Channel Partner and I was really just using them as a basis for an idea for a Registrar solution that would suit those who may opt to be Nominet Registrars at the moment. If a registrar similar to Daily did offer free Registrant transfers, as an ACP, but not free Registrar changes (i.e. they charged more than £0 but less than £10 to "tag change") this would encourage transferees to retain and renew their domain names with that registrar.

If you know of any registrars that offer free registrant transfers please let me know as that would definitely be a favourable reason to stay / move with them! I don't know of any but i would definitely welcome to hear of any?

 

[Lovekraft]

The automaton is actually going EOL next month I believe.

My point is that if a well designed Registrar offered free transfers to any registrants at the same registrar it could take the Transferrer just seconds to create a new account at that Registrar for the Transferee using the Transferees email address, assuming the Transferee didn't already have an account with that Registrar, before emailing those account login details to the pending new Registrant, who would login with them, change the password and complete their other contact details. At the same time the domain name could be pushed into that account by the Transferrer and the push would effect Registrant change at the Registrar but at no charge.

Well until that happens it isn't at presnt an option that i know of. So you're point isn't a current or valid reason to not become Nom member because you are talking about an option that doesn't actually exist to my knowledge.

 

[ian]

I haven't checked whether Daily are an Accredited Channel Partner and I was really just using them as a basis for an idea for a Registrar solution that would suit those who may opt to be Nominet Registrars at the moment. If a registrar similar to Daily did offer free Registrant transfers, as an ACP, but not free Registrar changes (i.e. they charged more than £0 but less than £10 to "tag change") this would encourage transferees to retain and renew their domain names with that registrar.

We had this conversation prior. Daily claim tag transfers at least are provided 'free' within the renewal charge (or they did when I last checked), yet charge to transfer when you try. I had it out with them and they've enabled free transfers on all my domains, but not once said they'd correct their marketing. That of course is a registrar change, not sure about registrant!

 

[RobM]

So are you saying that people running a business (profit) should not make money but people given a business (non-profit) can raise prices 50% and that's ok? I am genuinely confused by your posts which seem to be contradictory - sometimes in the *same* post.

 

[monaghan]

I have actually begun to think that encouraging anyone and everyone to become A Nominet member and Registrar is not necessarily the best way forward. Being a Nominet Registrar does and rightly should require a higher level of expertise than being just a Registrant. Do you agree or disagree on that?

I'd disagree, surely we want as many active people in the domain industry (whether domainers ISP or other interests) to be involved with Nominet so that the membership is broad and wide? Yes being a registrar does require a bit higher understanding than a simple registrant, however, given the entry requirements, it's not exactly that hard go get in is it? (My .NZ membership actually required me to perform specified tasks against their test registry system, my Nominet membership simply asked for the cash and a few simple questions!)

I've recently begun to realise that several Nominet members don't understand when they're logging in as a Registrar and when as a Registrant, particularly when they're using the same email address for both accounts. Some might also be better off using a well designed interface of a third party Registrar instead of spending time getting involved at a Registrar level. We wouldn't encourage everyone buying .com's to become ICANN accredited because the cost is prohibitive and the processes involved are even more involved. I realise some have become Members and Registrars because doing so offers DAC and EPP access required for drop catching but I wonder whether many would bother with this if there wasn't this requirement. Everyone ideally wants the cheapest prices but a Registrar selling at a few pence above cost and with an excellent UI might tip the balance for some. Such a registrar could be an Accredited Channel Partner and offer free or cheap transfers via its own interface further negating the need to get involved with Nominet Registrants online. Furthermore the domain name transferee (the recipient) could be given an account on that Registrar as part of the transfer and encouraged to remain with that Registrar when the domain name was transferred. No need for tag changes and Nominet accounts this way. Thoughts appreciated.

My reasoning for becoming a member is that you can bypass these 3rd party systems, just look at how many company XXX has lost my domain threads there has been on here and other forums.

If you want the cheapest price regardless of other factors that may cost you more in the long run, then yes, shop round the budget providers and hope for the best, but that's hardly a strategy I'd recommend to anyone in any line of business. A company selling a domain for a few pence over the wholesale cost and credit card fee is hardly going to have much left in the pot to provide good customer service should you need it.

ICANN is out of the grasp of many due to the costs, but why wouldn't we all want to aspire to that membership? Nominet is in reach for virtually every domainer that has the ability to sell a half decent domain for profit, so in my opinion, lets get them ALL to join Nominet and contribute to the running of it, not just grab wholesale prices, DAC, EPP and not bother to vote. As a community we're quick enough to complain about Nominet, but how many have actually joined and even been to an event, let alone taken time to give proper feedback on surveys or policy proposals?

 

[RobM]

No.

Ok guess I misunderstood you when you said 'I see little point in an Accredited Channel Partner Registrar charging for a Registrant name change'. If you need help to see the point I'm sure anyone can explain it to you.

 

[bluerock]

Anyone having problems accessing "web domain manager"?
Just times out for me

 

[foz]

Anyone having problems accessing "web domain manager"?
Just times out for me

Seen a few error pages. Works though.

 

[atlas]

Timing out for me.

 

[diablo]

Fine here.

 

[ian]

What an absolute ballache! Purchased a domain name from a registrant using a generic registrar, so helped them with the Nominet process of transfer to my email address. However, where as before, you could click the link in the email, then log in to any Nominet account you want to complete the transfer, this time it gave me absolutely no option but to enter every single detail, then log in after and change it to match the rest on my tag. Tried a number of ways, including logging in first etc, nothing, wouldn't allow me the option to use an existing account. Thought Nominet would have got hold of their third party mate of a mate to fix the back-end system by now. Maybe they are just waiting on the next wire transfer of millions!

 

[ian]

Isn't this the port 8443 issue discussed elsewhere? When you logged in, presuming into your Registrar account, did you proceed to click the Your Domains link at the bottom to be transferred to the Registrant interface (on port 8443)? I've explained it earlier, probably in this thread, and when I tried it I didn't need to enter everything in the way you have described.

Not sure, there was no login link. The point being, there was before, so why mess it up! I shouldn't have to circumnavigate what has worked for years!

 

[ian]

So no login link in a blue box as shown in the (hopefully) attached screen grab of the resulting web page that appeared from a transfer link I just sent myself?

Nope, 100% wasn't there. This isn't my first rodeo, the option was missing.

 

[ian]

Thought about the "missing blue box for login" aspect after I last posted. From investigating further the blue login box doesn't appear if one is already logged into a Nominet Registrant account (for those Registrars that use the same email address to login to both a Registrar and Registrant account, they need to have navigated to the port 8443 site).

Given the other changes to email addresses connected to accounts you were undertaking yesterday, if you didn't see a blue box you were likely logged in to an account already. I've just seen it for myself. Whether it was the account you wanted to be logged into, I don't know!

Tried both ways, initially logged out, and when that didn't offer the login box, I tried logging in first and reattempting the link. No joy. Anyway, I've reported my findings back to Nominet. Thanks for your suggestions though.

 

[ian]

So, just in case it helps anyone else out, though David has already pointed to this. I received a transfer request via email, clicked the link, was offered the blue box this time to log in (I wasn't logged in at the time). Logged in, tried the link again only to have the same option to log in. It seems for some reason you must click on 'Domain Manager' first for the system to know you are logged in, possibly because this section uses a different platform to the part of your registrar information and Web Domain Manager. How daft, no idea why they can't use the same platform for those of us using the same email for both!

 

[Systreg]

I've just accepted a transfer and got the blue box with the message to login, which I did. I returned to the email, clicked the link and was again presented with the blue box to login.

I logged in for a second time after reading the posts above on here first, and clicked the "Domain Manager" as suggested in Ian's post above, which worked and I was able to do the transfer.

After completing it, a green box popped up on another tab I had open in the transfer section saying 2 domains had been transferred, no idea what that was about as it was only 1 domain I received and the message didn't say what the 2 domains were

 

[grantw]

Those green notifications seem to build up and pop up when they feel like it. One was probably from a previous transfer.