EU Referendum

[gimpydog]

I don't understand what you mean by this? Are you suggesting Branson doesn't do anything for the UK?

No, I'm stating that he is no longer resident in the UK for tax purposes & is ineligible to vote in this referendum

Therefore, his opinions carry very little no weight.

 

[bonusmedia]

There is no truth or lies with economic forecasts, is there? Just different opinions.

Let us judge them on there past records, or wait a while longer & judge them on these forecasts.

People can be honest or dishonest in their opinions. It might well be that some experts are being dishonest - but it doesn't seem likely they all are. To get back to your cartoon the vast majority of the world's scientists have been saying for a long time that climate change is 'the inconvenient truth' - a lot of people just don't want to hear it.

 

[bonusmedia]

No, I'm stating that he is no longer resident in the UK for tax purposes & is ineligible to vote in this referendum

Therefore his opinions carry very little no weight in my opinion.

I think they carry quite a lot of weight, since he has numerous companies in the UK and employs huge numbers of people here - and also since he is a respected strategist and massively successful businessman. I think we can assume he knows a bit about the numbers.

I don't like the fact he's resident offshore but that's up to him - and I don't resent his enormous success. He's done more for this country than you or I can ever hope to

 

[bonusmedia]

How smart is it of Corbyn not go in for the kill just yet.
You could not put it past him to help the leave vote next week and ensure the Tories are left in turmoil. He has always been difficult in towing the line. Skinner went over and Mann spoke on behalf of the Party and said they would help vote down Osborn's emergency budget.

Labour are anti-austerity, of course they won't support more austerity

 

[dougs]

Don't believe in sovereignty? Don't believe in being able to make, change or repeal the laws of your own country? That's crazy to me.

""Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety (money), deserve neither Liberty nor Safety." - Benjamin Franklin.

Sovereignty is not Liberty

 

[dougs]

I think if someone says they don't believe in sovereignty on the remain side ,their opinions are as valid to the argument as a self confessed racist on the leave side.

agreed

 

[BREWSTERS]

Sovereignty is not Liberty

It is to a degree. What's certain is that having no sovereignty is the same as having no liberty...and no opportunity to do anything about it.

 

[dougs]

A mate came over today and was very pro LEAVE and he gave me the best argument to leave I have ever heard:

After we leave things will go into turmoil
Things will be a mess
Most people are not aware of the shit they will create if we leave
Out of the shit we better learn to do something good or we are stuffed
He believes we will do something good as that is what humanity as done over years.


Doug

 

[dougs]

It is to a degree. What's certain is that having no sovereignty is the same as having no liberty...and no opportunity to do anything about it.

liberty is freedom that has little to do with sovereignty...

 

[dougs]

Makes a mockery of having the rules then.

If farmers were allowed to farm to their potential it makes sense that they could produce more at a lower price to the consumer.

And remember, those subsidies aren't a gift from Europe....it's our money they're using. In effect, you and I are paying UK farmers to not farm, whilst helping farmers elsewhere to sell into our market. Utter madness.

Fishermen fished dry the North Sea ...humans go for short term gains

 

[dougs]

No, I'm stating that he is no longer resident in the UK for tax purposes & is ineligible to vote in this referendum

Therefore, his opinions carry very little no weight.

I believe he is a British Citizen, living overseas but has been for less than 15 years so he is allowed to vote

 

[Edwin]

What is the one EU policy you'd most like to see changed?
- Free movement of people
- Power of the ECJ over national courts
- Relative non-accountability of the European Commission
- European Convention on Human Rights
- The EU contribution system and the EU levy
- Something else?

If you had free rein to modify or abolish the thing you chose above, would that tip your view of the EU?

 

[Toonz]

What is the one EU policy you'd most like to see changed?
- Free movement of people
- Power of the ECJ over national courts
- Relative non-accountability of the European Commission
- European Convention on Human Rights
- The EU contribution system and the EU levy
- Something else?

If you had free rein to modify or abolish the thing you chose above, would that tip your view of the EU?

Most urgent to me?

- Relative non-accountability of the European Commission

(by a country mile, as Farage, pint in hand, would probably say)

 

[martin-s]

What is the one EU policy you'd most like to see changed?
- Free movement of people
- Power of the ECJ over national courts
- Relative non-accountability of the European Commission
- European Convention on Human Rights
- The EU contribution system and the EU levy
- Something else?

If you had free rein to modify or abolish the thing you chose above, would that tip your view of the EU?

The whole point of voting leave is to have more power to change ALL of these things!

 

[Edwin]

The whole point of voting leave is to have more power to change ALL of these things!

My original question never said anything about other things staying the same. Your reply implied it did. Most people have an order of preference, even amongst things all of which they like or value or enjoy. I was trying to dig into what was #1 on their particular list.

In other words, all I was asking was: what is the most important change individual posters would like to see? And if that thing (the thing most important to them) changed, would it tip their view of the EU?

 

[Edwin]

This explainer, from the NZ Herald, does a better job than most of explaining the 4 main trade models open to the UK post-brexit. It highlights the pros and cons of each particular model very simply and suscinctly.
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/news/article.cfm?c_id=2&objectid=11657779

 

[Edwin]

Interesting and telling comment in this video interview from the FT with their Chief Political Commentator.

Q: Did David Cameron make a big mistake in calling for a referendum?
A: He made a terrible mistake, and if it's a Leave vote, he will go down in history as the prime minister who made the biggest peace time mistake in post-war history.

http://video.ft.com/4943008783001/Camerons-terrible-mistake-on-Brexit/latest

 

[BREWSTERS]

liberty is freedom that has little to do with sovereignty...

Within the discussion of in or out of the EU, sovereignty represents liberty as the freedom to decide the laws of the land.

 

[BREWSTERS]

Most urgent to me?

- Relative non-accountability of the European Commission

(by a country mile, as Farage, pint in hand, would probably say)

You can take out the word 'relative'.

Not audited for 20 years.....one rule for one, one law for the rest.

 

[martin-s]

My original question never said anything about other things staying the same. Your reply implied it did. Most people have an order of preference, even amongst things all of which they like or value or enjoy. I was trying to dig into what was #1 on their particular list.

This is why you don't understand the Brexit position. All of these are deal breakers:

• Free movement of people
• Power of the ECJ over national courts
• Relative non-accountability of the European Commission
• European Convention on Human Rights
• The EU contribution system and the EU levy