EU Referendum

[Edwin]

In 5 years it'll be old news and everyone will have moved on. Indeed the EU want the article 50 process to start immediately to avoid prolonging the the uncertainty on the markets.

They're right that not activating it prolongs the uncertainty.

Interestingly, Leave spokespeople seem not only be in no hurry to do so, but positively against activating it any time soon. John Redwood told the BBC just a short while ago that he could see a case for it never being activated at all, because why would the UK want to give up its special status (that from a very firm Leaver)!

I've not had the chance to dig into it, but there may be something in Article 50 or elsewhere that allows the EU to start the process from its end...

 

[scottmccloud]

The referendum vote, amongst other things has exposed the divides between England and Scotland, London and the rest of the England and younger and older members of society. If this country is so divided, an ever expanding and closer integrated European Union was really never going to work was it?

 

[websaway]

Morgan Stanley has just announced they're moving 2,000 jobs from London to Frankfurt and Dublin, according to BBC sources. These are likely to be high end, highly paid jobs since they're in the "investment banking" arm of the firm.

That might reduce property price rises in the capital.

 

[looks]

That shows a clear picture. http://election.news.sky.com/referendum

East Midlands – OUT
Eastern – OUT
London – IN
North East – OUT
North West – OUT
Northern Ireland – IN
Scotland – IN
South East – OUT
South West & Gibraltar – OUT
Wales – OUT
West Midlands – OUT
Yorkshire & The Humber – OUT

 

[websaway]

I think seen from the prism of distance, it may turn out in the coming weeks and months that the big issue wasn't the referendum itself, but the setting of a simple majority as the dividing line. A decision as momentous and earth-shattering as this may have deserved a higher threshold. After all, there is no rule that states it had to be 50% (at the time the refendum was first mooted, I mean)

Tell me I'm reading this wrong, you are saying that the goal posts should have been narrower for a Brexit.

 

[Edwin]

Tell me I'm reading this wrong, you are saying that the goal posts should have been narrower for a Brexit.

That's exactly what I was saying. There are concepts such as a double majority or an absolute majority that have been applied to momentous decisions in various other countries.

But don't forget the first part of my post when quoting the second! I said it "may" turn out "in the coming weeks and months".

Anyway, it's a moot point but an interesting thought experiment.

 

[BREWSTERS]

Morgan Stanley has just announced they're moving 2,000 jobs from London to Frankfurt and Dublin, according to BBC sources. These are likely to be high end, highly paid jobs since they're in the "investment banking" arm of the firm.

The majority of them in the 'euro clearing dept' whatever that means.

 

[ian]

So in all 'balanced reality' it's years away before they could even countenance it - by which time I am sure there will be a lot more stability and therefore a lot less potential 'OUT' voters.

...and by then, they'd be joining what's left of the EU as we know it!

 

[BREWSTERS]

That shows a clear picture. http://election.news.sky.com/referendum

East Midlands – OUT
Eastern – OUT
London – IN
North East – OUT
North West – OUT
Northern Ireland – IN
Scotland – IN
South East – OUT
South West & Gibraltar – OUT
Wales – OUT
West Midlands – OUT
Yorkshire & The Humber – OUT

Simples - get everyone in Scotland to move to London and fence it off

 

[websaway]

That's exactly what I was saying. There are concepts such as a double majority or an absolute majority that have been applied to momentous decisions in various other countries.

But don't forget the first part of my post when quoting the second! I said it "may" turn out "in the coming weeks and months".

Anyway, it's a moot point but an interesting thought experiment.

Sorry, I think I misunderstood.

 

[spiderspider]

I've not had the chance to dig into it, but there may be something in Article 50 or elsewhere that allows the EU to start the process from its end...

No.

Article 50 gets started by the country leaving. Seems the MPs have chosen not to do it right away, which I agree with. The MAJORITY of the country have basically stuck 2 fingers up to Brussels, and said you don't rule us. Brussels may well want us to activate article 50, but its not up to them, and has diddly squat to do with them, as to when we decide to activate it

If they wanted to kick us out, that would be a different matter, and would probably take longer than an article 50 that will probably be activated in October / November time.

 

[Skinner]

I just a comment on Facebook to the effect of Cameron has thrown himself on his sword to create 3-4 months gap of informal negotiation before a new PM is in place to start A50. As only the PM can start it (apparently)

Nice idea for the history books.

 

[spiderspider]

I just a comment on Facebook to the effect of Cameron has thrown himself on his sword

Thats quite a calm and measured way looking at it. Some I've seen are more akin to him walking in a meeting room,sitting down, pulling the pin on a hand grenade, standing up saying you deal with it, and walking out.

 

[martin-s]

Morgan Stanley has just announced they're moving 2,000 jobs from London to Frankfurt and Dublin, according to BBC sources. These are likely to be high end, highly paid jobs since they're in the "investment banking" arm of the firm.

No, that's not entirely correct.

Inside sources have said that they are stepping up a programme which may see jobs being relocated. The bank itself have denied they've started relocating anyone.

 

[gimpydog]

Looks like the 'experts' were wrong again.

Who's the daddy now?....

 

[gimpydog]

All my dollar purchase in the next few days just got expensive

On the plus side, I don't think there's ever been a better time to buy a .uk domain name!

Just got this from InternetBS...

Dear Customer,

Due to recent fluctuations in currency values and exchange rates we have reviewed our pricing across all currencies and wish to inform you we will be making some changes to our pricing.

Where possible we have aimed to bring the benefit of these currency value changes to our customers (for example .co.uk domains will now be priced at 6.51 USD {previously 7.10 USD}) but there will be some domains which are now more expensive, particularly in the GBP and EUR currencies.

It's just that realistically, the British people are not going to vote for Corbyn

And yesterday you didn't think they would vote 'leave'.

It goes to show that if Scotland had the same level of turnout as the rest of the home nations, the result would likely to have been different.

How so?

The trouble with democracy is, how many people were actually educated enough to vote on the issue

It's not rocket surgery.

I think seen from the prism of distance, it may turn out in the coming weeks and months that the big issue wasn't the referendum itself, but the setting of a simple majority as the dividing line. A decision as momentous and earth-shattering as this may have deserved a higher threshold. After all, there is no rule that states it had to be 50% (at the time the refendum was first mooted, I mean)

Are you Tim Farron in disguise?

 

[Edwin]

Thats quite a calm and measured way looking at it. Some I've seen are more akin to him walking in a meeting room,sitting down, pulling the pin on a hand grenade, standing up saying you deal with it, and walking out.

That's more than a little unfair, no matter what your political inclination.

He has worn himself out criss-crossing the country over the last few months warning of the perils of brexit. His warnings have been loud, specific, clear.

We are only about 9 hours into a "definitive" brexit environment, and already many of the warnings have come true:
- Scotland renewing calls for independence
- Northern Ireland making independence rumblings
- Economic turmoil
- Job losses (again, remember we're only 9 hours in and already cuts of several thousand positions have been announced!)
- etc. etc.

It is therefore utterly unsurprising, and indeed quite understandable, for him to be unwilling to clean up this impossible mess that he poured so much energy and passion into warning the country against in the first place.

 

[gimpydog]

We are only about 9 hours into a "definitive" brexit environment, and already many of the warnings have come true:
- Scotland renewing calls for independence
- Northern Ireland making independence rumblings
- Economic turmoil
- Job losses (again, remember we're only 9 hours in and already cuts of several thousand positions have been announced!)
- etc. etc.

Don't you think the time for project fear has passed?

Let it go man.

 

[Edwin]

Don't you think the time for project fear has passed?

Let it go man.

This is beyond ridiculous.

Leave has won. I fully acknowledge that.

But now that Leave has won, there's no need to resort to such nonsensical labels any more! It's about time to allow reality back into the picture.

Project fear is actually project fact: The things that I listed are happening right now. Take a look at the BBC news feed, or the Guardian, or any other similar news outlet. There have been enough updates today to show that I'm not making any of it up.

Leave may well bring benefits. Time will tell. But the immediate, near-instant consequences of the vote result map almost perfectly into the scenarios that the widely derided experts have been putting so much energy into warning about.

There's no fear in that, they're just describing the world as it is now.

 

[VSC]

Looks like the 'experts' were wrong again.

Much too early to say - let's review in 3-4 years.

Let's just not have any nonsense if some of the "experts" were correct, and that somehow the remnants of remain, or the EU have "fixed it" against the UK. The EU now has to think of their own interests, and if their interests do not match the UKs, well that's just tough.

I hope that they are not for the sake of my children, but the UK has taken a new direction and we will all have to wait and see what the future brings.