Why do we struggle?

[Retired_Member42]

@redemption

@sean

methinks your both still dodging my question

Your both experts in 'domain names', so tell me (us all) what should they have choosen instead of lights.co.uk - I'm happy to say that i think this is a very good domain for their market sector and although it not *perfection* the positives out weight the negatives, 80/20 if you like.

You've both clearly stated that its not very to use this sort of domain any more because of the 'loss of brand recognition' in that particular space and fact Lights.co.uk 'maybe' are going to lose a portion of the market share because of the generic nature of the name, confusion etc. which I understand is your view point. Can we assume buying it this late in the game to was not for emd boost anyway.

We all must be able to come up with a brand name instead of Lights.co.uk this thread is nearly 3 days old now all that time to think about it

Here's mine UberLights.co.uk - its German and English combo, what do we think?

Thanks.

Not dodging it. Just refusing to answer it as I pointed out above.

 

[crazihos]

Really interesting thread and redemption makes some great and very valid points.

I think a lot also depends on the market targeted. Lights.co.uk may well be looking to advertise is grand designs magazine and the hundreds of other property magazines. I think the domain gives them a leg up there in the memory stakes. Something like glow.co.uk would have worked equally as well and as redemption said, it wouldn't have the negative Seo issues but I'm sure lights.co.uk will work well for them if they do target press's marketing.

One thing that may work for them is that journalists may see them as an instant authority enabling them to get higher quality links easier than a cheaper brandable would. That would offset some of the negatives mentioned but not all of them.

I recently paid a fair sum for a pretty average emd and I'm still not 100% it was the right thing to buy - I wrestled with the decision. It's a fairly niche market where one of the market leaders is running on a double hyphen domain though and there are already loads of smaller competitors running on brandables. I didn't think the competition was fierce in Seo terms and press marketing is an option on this project so the emd was a way to stand out in the market.

Time will tell if I've ballsed up but my rational was that there are occasions where an emd can still be the right decision. But I totally agree that in many cases they can work against you.

 

[Retired_Member42]

I think a lot also depends on the market targeted. Lights.co.uk may well be looking to advertise is grand designs magazine and the hundreds of other property magazines. I think the domain gives them a leg up there in the memory stakes. Something like glow.co.uk would have worked equally as well and as redemption said, it wouldn't have the negative Seo issues but I'm sure lights.co.uk will work well for them if they do target press's marketing.

This is part of the reason I say there is no one size fits all when it comes to choosing a domain/brand. It's impossible to name alternative for Lights.co.uk as I've no idea on their business model and their ultimate goals. It may turn out to be a good buy for them but I just think if you want to attack from all angles, which you really should with any project then it was a bit of a bad move.

One thing that may work for them is that journalists may see them as an instant authority enabling them to get higher quality links easier than a cheaper brandable would. That would offset some of the negatives mentioned but not all of them.

Possibly in this case as the site is reasonable. The trouble I find with a lot of EMD users is that they think an EMD is a free ticket to the top of the SERPs or are of the mentality that their domain counts for significantly more than it really does. This often leads to them not putting as much time and effort into the site design/build/marketing as they should. Even their service/product offering may be poor as a result of putting too much faith in the weight of their domain. It's rare to find someone who truly believes in the power of an EMD, enough to get their wallet out but is not of the mindset that it's a free ride.

I think a lot of it is about being educated on the matter too. If you're working with an EMD, knowing what you need to do on the site front and knowing the pitfalls offsite can seriously work in your favour but most people who buy EMD's do so for the quick and easy (perceived) way to success when it really isn't that straight forward any more as you know.

 

[gimpydog]

you only have to look at what businesses are using, the search results and domain name sales to see the way it's going.

Wise words from Redemption. Google 'lights' & lights.co.uk is nowhere for me, not even top 100.

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=lights

1. johnlewis.com
2. homebase.co.uk
3. diy.com
4. argos.co.uk
5. debenhams.com
6. next.co.uk
7. bhs.co.uk
8. amazon.co.uk
9. ikea.com
10. Images for lights
11. independent.co.uk
12. nature.com

Most commercial sites are being beaten by Google images & a newspaper article!

 

[Retired_Member42]

Wise words from Redemption. Google 'lights' & lights.co.uk is nowhere for me, not even top 100.

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=lights

1. johnlewis.com
2. homebase.co.uk
3. diy.com
4. argos.co.uk
5. debenhams.com
6. next.co.uk
7. bhs.co.uk
8. amazon.co.uk
9. ikea.com
10. Images for lights
11. independent.co.uk
12. nature.com

Most commercial sites are being beaten by Google images & a newspaper article!

They're truly being left in the dark

 

[websaway]

Wise words from Redemption. Google 'lights' & lights.co.uk is nowhere for me, not even top 100.

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=lights

1. johnlewis.com
2. homebase.co.uk
3. diy.com
4. argos.co.uk
5. debenhams.com
6. next.co.uk
7. bhs.co.uk
8. amazon.co.uk
9. ikea.com
10. Images for lights
11. independent.co.uk
12. nature.com

Most commercial sites are being beaten by Google images & a newspaper article!

So Lights.dot co dot uk

Probably the best way to attempt to compete with these multi billion, multi national ,historic brands where money to them is no object.

 

[humble pie]

@redemption

thought you didn't go in for emds?

https://domainlore.uk/flyerdesign.co.uk

 

[Retired_Member42]

@redemption

thought you didn't go in for emds?

https://domainlore.uk/flyerdesign.co.uk

Is that how it's going to be now? Please don't assume any domain I buy or catch is for personal use

I will buy/catch ANY domain that I think I can make a profit on. This being one of them.

I said earlier in the post I will continue to trade in EMD's whilst there is still a market for it and have no problem with others doing the same. But if you're asking me if I think it's a good match for a company selling flyer design services personally? No, I don't.

And please don't assume my sales pitch for selling this domain is going to talk about local exacts or how it can benefit you in terms of SEO. It will not. My sales pitch is already nothing more than "I am selling domain.co.uk..." with a fixed price or open to offers. If people see the value so be it. My job is not to educate people in what they should be using, it's to make a profit.

 

[humble pie]

I was thinking it would look pretty darn good and work well used in adwords campaign to a smart html5 lander... I guess not

 

[Retired_Member42]

I was thinking it would look pretty darn good and work well used in adwords campaign to a smart html5 lander... I guess not

My issue with it if we're talking this specific domain is that it's too specific. Perhaps as a lander for this specific service on PPC you could save a little bit of £ with the quality scoring but for a company running a business like with most EMD's it's too specific. There are not many companies who solely offer flyer design. Most offer logos, business cards, stationery and so on.

But on the flip side to that, if you're paying money for the click you at least want some customer retention, brand recognition and the possible cross sell of the above related services. If you're combining all that on a lander you're diluting the key service and would be much better off promoting your brand directly.

 

[Retired_Member42]

Funnily enough, I actually tried to buy this domain when I was in the niche. I used to be top of Google for "logo design" in the UK and highly ranked in the US too. I was quoted mid £XXX for it but the keyword was too small that it didn't warrant a new site build/promotional costs so I left it. Perhaps it's a bit of nostalgia creeping in

 

[humble pie]

Wel you not what they say..

When an honest man discovers he is mistaken, he will either cease being mistaken, or cease being honest.

 

[websaway]

Funnily enough, I actually tried to buy this domain when I was in the niche. I used to be top of Google for "logo design" in the UK and highly ranked in the US too. I was quoted mid £XXX for it but the keyword was too small that it didn't warrant a new site build/promotional costs so I left it. Perhaps it's a bit of nostalgia creeping in

search for logo design on major search engine.

https://www.google.co.uk/?gws_rd=ssl#q=logo+design

logodesign dot co dot uk on the front page.


I had to smile.

 

[Retired_Member42]

search for logo design on major search engine.

https://www.google.co.uk/?gws_rd=ssl#q=logo+design

logodesign dot co dot uk on the front page.


I had to smile.

It's been up there for the best part of 10 years. Quite a few EMD's got grandfathered in, I still own some but there is no way I'd even consider trying to do it now. Big big difference in an EMD ranking that's been there 10 years and is a very established business to someone choosing to use one day one.

 

[Retired_Member42]

Wel you not what they say..

When an honest man discovers he is mistaken, he will either cease being mistaken, or cease being honest.

I don't use tampons but if I could buy them for £1 and sell them for £2, I'd do it

 

[Trigger Happy]

Wel you not what they say..

When an honest man discovers he is mistaken, he will either cease being mistaken, or cease being honest.

Haven't heard this one before - I think it quite accurately describes many people that hold big portfolios of EMD domains now that the exact match benefit is gone!

 

[humble pie]

But it hasn't really gone has it?

Its only *gone* for people pumping out retarded 5 page mini-sites on wp with keyword riddled urls and no idea about seo, in fact if you read about g's latest proposed algo changes and the way it sees sites its all pointing towards takign in to account quality urls again.

Haven't heard this one before - I think it quite accurately describes many people that hold big portfolios of EMD domains now that the exact match benefit is gone!

 

[Retired_Member42]

But it hasn't really gone has it?

Its only *gone* for people pumping out retarded 5 page mini-sites on wp with keyword riddled urls and no idea about seo, in fact if you read about g's latest proposed algo changes and the way it sees sites its all pointing towards takign in to account quality urls again.

And what defines a "quality url" - the size of your wallet? That sounds like a great metric.

 

[Trigger Happy]

But it hasn't really gone has it?

Its only *gone* for people pumping out retarded 5 page mini-sites on wp with keyword riddled urls and no idea about seo, in fact if you read about g's latest proposed algo changes and the way it sees sites its all pointing towards takign in to account quality urls again.

Well given that it no longer exists I would say that yes its gone.

 

[Retired_Member42]

But it hasn't really gone has it?

Its only *gone* for people pumping out retarded 5 page mini-sites on wp with keyword riddled urls and no idea about seo, in fact if you read about g's latest proposed algo changes and the way it sees sites its all pointing towards takign in to account quality urls again.

If this was a post from 2 years ago I'd be inclined to believe you but I've yet to see one fresh EMD in the SERPs in the past 2 years ranking for anything significant. Sure some got grandfathered in and some rank them for keywords with no competition (something you could go with a none-EMD) but for the most part, they're on par with a none-EMD yet have negatives which make using them completely pointless.