.uk And Drop Catching - Anti-gaming measures:

[arkvard]

I could be wrong but I read it slightly differently...

If a co.uk domain drops, then any rights goes with it. "There is no ‘second choice’ mechanism". The right does not ever get passed on to an org.uk.

The .org.uk only gets the rights if it was registered at the cut off and there was no co.uk registered at the cutoff.

If both org.uk and co.uk were registered at cutoff, the co.uk is the one with the right. If the co.uk is then dropped, then the rights drops with it. The right DOESN'T get passed on to the org.uk, even if the org.uk was registered before the cut-off.

So who would be entitled to the .uk?

 

[Retired_member41]

I could be wrong but I read it slightly differently...

If a co.uk domain drops, then any rights goes with it. "There is no ‘second choice’ mechanism". The right does not ever get passed on to an org.uk.

The .org.uk only gets the rights if it was registered at the cut off and there was no co.uk registered at the cutoff.

If both org.uk and co.uk were registered at cutoff, the co.uk is the one with the right. If the co.uk is then dropped, then the rights drops with it. The right DOESN'T get passed on to the org.uk, even if the org.uk was registered before the cut-off.

That's it exactly

 

[grantw]

Sorry, my post was referring to the initial period between the cutoff date and the launch date:

"Are any rights conferred on new .co.uk domains registered after the 28th October 2013, but before the launch date?

Yes, so long as the string wasn’t registered in another suffix on 28th October 2013, in which case that other suffix will get the right to the .uk over the subsequent .co.uk registration. However, if that other suffix is then cancelled between 28th Oct 2013 and the launch date, the .co.uk registered inside the same period will get the right to the .uk."

Grant

 

[donreeco]

So who would be entitled to the .uk?

Whoever registers the co.uk (before launch) - I assume.

 

[Systreg]

"Are any rights conferred on new .co.uk domains registered after the 28th October 2013, but before the launch date?

Yes, so long as the string wasn’t registered in another suffix on 28th October 2013, in which case that other suffix will get the right to the .uk over the subsequent .co.uk registration.

What happens then in this made up example:

bluewidgets.org.uk is regged for 2 years on Sep 20th 2012

bluewidgets.co.uk drops and is caught on Nov 6th 2013

The owner of bluewidgets.org.uk is entitled to register bluewidgets.uk and registers it.

However, if that other suffix is then cancelled between 28th Oct 2013 and the launch date, the .co.uk registered inside the same period will get the right to the .uk.

I think Nominet needs to change the wording of that last quote to avoid any confusion, as it only implies that the owner of bluewidgets.org.uk didn't bother registering bluewidgets.uk, suggesting the owner of the .co.uk can register it.

What if the owner of bluewidgets.org.uk decide they no longer want to use the bluewidgets.org.uk and in 2014 they let it drop, does that mean the owner of bluewidgets.co.uk can now claim bluewidgets.uk? No, because even though the owner dropped their org.uk, they still own the .uk

 

[grantw]

Now I'm confused again.

It say's there is no second chance mechanism but in the example above - bluewidgets.co.uk would originally have had the right to .uk, it then drops, on the basis of no second chance the .org.uk then doesn't have a right to .uk.

But....If bluewidgets.co.uk is then re-registered bluewidgets.org.uk suddenly gets the right to .uk because it predates the cut off date and the .co.uk was registered after the cut off.

???!?!

 

[timter51]

I think this thread proves that it needs to be absolutely clarified by Nominet It can be interpreted in different ways.

 

[donreeco]

What happens then in this made up example:

bluewidgets.org.uk is regged for 2 years on Sep 20th 2012

bluewidgets.co.uk drops and is caught on Nov 6th 2013

The owner of bluewidgets.org.uk is entitled to register bluewidgets.uk and registers it.

The way I read it...

I don't think bluewidgets.org.uk will be entitled to register bluewidgets.uk. It was bluewidgets.co.uk that had the rights and they didn't use them.

The right only ever goes to the co.uk.

The one exception is if a charity or similar is the only with a name at cut-off and it happens to be an org.uk. In that case, you can't register the co.uk after the cut-off and trump them.

 

[grantw]

I assume the second choice answer relates to domains dropping after the launch date:

"If there is a clash, and the domain registrant with the rights to the .uk domain doesn’t want it (or if their domain registration drops) is the other registrant offered ‘second choice’ before the domain goes on the open market?

No. There is no ‘second choice’ mechanism."

So, to amend my original interpretation:

If registered, .co.uk wins in all cases unless it is registered after the cut off date (and before the launch date) AND a .org.uk exists from before the cut off date. If the latter scenario occurs and the .org.uk drops (before the launch date) then the rights go to the .co.uk.

This suggests that if a .co.uk drops before the launch date and there is an existing .org.uk registered before the cut off date then that will gain the right to the .uk.

Think I'll wait for Nominet to put it all down in black and white

Grant

 

[donreeco]

If registered, .co.uk wins in all cases unless it is registered after the cut off date (and before the launch date) AND a .org.uk exists from before the cut off date. If the latter scenario occurs and the .org.uk drops (before the launch date) then the rights go to the .co.uk.

In my view, it would need this key detail (in bold) -

If registered, .co.uk wins in all cases unless it is registered after the cut off date (and before the launch date) AND a .org.uk exists from before the cut off date, which had the rights at the cut-off. If the latter scenario occurs and the .org.uk drops (before the launch date) then the rights go to the .co.uk

 

[Aaron Clifford]

I haven't read the whole posts above but:

I spoke to Nominet about this exact thing today and they confirmed to me that:

If a .co.uk is registered after the 28th October 2013 it will only get right of refusal if there are NO other contesting domains (.org.uk,.me.uk etc).

The dropping and re registration after the 28th would only be given right of refusal again if there are none other registered in the other extensions (same as above).

I also asked that if a .co.uk was registered after the 28th October and then during the five years if both the .org.uk and .me.uk drop and are registered (or not again), who has the right of refusal?

They confirmed that the .org.uk would have right of refusal and if they choose not to take the domain and let their domains expire the .co.uk would have no rights to the name despite being the oldest/only name registered, after five years the domain would be free to register.

 

[Murray]

So in 5 years there will probably be some good domains to register on a first come first served basis..

I call first dibs

 

[tifosi]

If a .co.uk is registered after the 28th October 2013 it will only get right of refusal if there are NO other contesting domains (.org.uk,.me.uk etc).

The dropping and re registration after the 28th would only be given right of refusal again if there are none other registered in the other extensions (same as above).

I also asked that if a .co.uk was registered after the 28th October and then during the five years if both the .org.uk and .me.uk drop and are registered (or not again), who has the right of refusal?

They confirmed that the .org.uk would have right of refusal and if they choose not to take the domain and let their domains expire the .co.uk would have no rights to the name despite being the oldest/only name registered, after five years the domain would be free to register.

Is that right? May be the case if the .co.uk was NOT already registered before 28th i.e. no contesting domains, but if the .co.uk was registered and then dropped and was re-registered... and then all other contesting domains dropped and were re registered then the .co.uk should come first. All about the contesting status at and before 28/10.

Hope nominet come out with some concrete examples like they did for the consultation!!

 

[Edwin]

The wording in their more detailed document is perhaps clearer:

Anti-gaming measures: To prevent the gaming of uncontested domains in Nominet-managed Second Level Domains other than .co.uk, we have decided to set a cut-off date of midnight on 28th October 2013, the day before our decision to proceed with SLDR. The registrants of these uncontested domain names are eligible for the Right of Refusal on the related .uk domain.

Any .co.uk domain names registered between the cut-off date and launch where there is a pre- existing uncontested domain in a Nominet managed Second Level Domain do not accrue a right of refusal to the .uk domain name. But any new co.uk registrations from the cut-off point will get a Right of Refusal to the corresponding second level if there is no pre-existing registered third level equivalent name.

http://www.nominet.org.uk/sites/default/files/SLDRdecisionpaper.pdf

 

[bulkcorn]

So in 5 years there will probably be some good domains to register on a first come first served basis..

I call first dibs

You'll be waiting yonks to catch / reg those 'good domains'! :lol:
-----------------

.co.uk regged by 28 Oct gets .uk
.co.uk regged (or caught) after 28 Oct will only get .uk if no prior regged tld.uk domains exist

...... I think that's what I gathered.

 

[tifosi]

Yes, but mine & Aarons examples are different, and potentially extend beyond the launch date and into the 5yr transition period.

 

[Skinner]

It will be interesting if nominet release the .uk's once the .co.uk or oldest option is gone rather than hold for 5 yrs.

 

[anthony]

Are there any serious implications for dropcatching in the future, especially with the very long 5 year period? Something at the back of my mind is questioning why they've put the 5 year thing into the mix!

 

[cm1975]

Are there any serious implications for dropcatching in the future, especially with the very long 5 year period? Something at the back of my mind is questioning why they've put the 5 year thing into the mix!

I'm assuming the 5 years is purely to allow companies a period of transition, especially those who, in the last year or so, have paid for the 10 year registration fee for a co.uk domain .... but I could be wrong!?

 

[tifosi]

They said it on their site that it was for businesses to be able to schedule their rebranding - signages etc - and that most businesses would do that as a normal business process during that time, which is a reasonable assumption imo.