Stolen domain!

[retired_member12]

This is like BP and the Gulf of Mexico, BP taking all the blame!

Who's playing the roles in the shadows of Transocean and Halliburton though!

 

[rob]

If my reading is right it seems the new registrant not DM at fault here the.

DM cocked up, but thats a human error, but admin email change password reset and transfer is terrible IMHO.

 

[golddiggerguy]

IF the case is DM never touched the domain after it was registered to me. Which I was told on the phone something like.......... "Looks like the system has been cleaned up on the account and the domain has been corrected to show the correct person"

Then DM have touched my nominet account... yes?.

If that's not the case then the current owner took it into their power to alter the admin email and transfer it over and quickly also move it away from DM's TAG

Yes, you are correct, we didn't interfere in anyway. We unfortunately didn't know until today. There is clearly an angle to be had here with the current owner via Nominet re the change if desired.

Who has done what?

Who took it upon themselves to change the admin email, access my nominet account which am I am correct in saying would have had OTHER domains in and then transfered it over.

 

[tifosi]

Simple fact is that is that however much DM screwed up the 'current' registrant contravened Nominets T&C by changing the domain admin email address and transferring the domain to themselves when they were NOT the rightful owner.

At most the 'current' owner is owed the backorder fee back, and at best DM should try and buy the domain from the rightful owner once it's transferred back to him via Nominet.

It's simply not acceptable for DM to say that they screwed up and really the right person got the domain in the end. Wrong. Once the domain is registered into a registrant's name the ONLY persons with the rightful permissions to transfer the domain are Nominet and the registrant on the whois. Period. No exceptions.

S

 

[GreyWing]

I've had my own tag for too long now and I'm obviously naive. Are you saying that if I had a domain registered with someone like Domain Monster and my domain inadvertently turned up in someone else's control panel, that they could then change my details at Nominet and transfer the domain away?

Yes mate, http://www.acorndomains.co.uk/nominet-general-information/75452-another-level-security.html here is Grant and Myself discussing that very point a few weeks ago. It can happen at any registrar, imagine the havoc one dodgy employee of a company could bring to the system with access to all those accounts.

I think we are on the same page. No I don't think we or anyone for that matter should retain a perpetual right to reverse a registration - at the very least not without correct adjudication.

Yep that's fair enough mate, seems we can both agree no matter what our views on it, it should be down to Nominet and those parties to sort out.

It seems fair enough, errors do happen with systems and if it were me I would not hold DM to blame for the transfer of the domain, that lies purely with the current owner.

 

[dotNetFreak]

DM have stated that the current owner is the correct owner and the fact that the whois was incorrect is their fault.

What would everyone have preferred DM to do? Update the whois themselves or delete and re-register the domain in the correct details (running the risk another catcher caught it in the meantime)? The end result would have been the same, the current owner would still own the domain...

Or leave as it was and transfer it into GDG's DM account?

GDG: I'm guessing that once a domain is in the DM control panel the user has the ability to change the e-mail address on the domain which would then allow them to access the domain via their Nominet account. I don't think for one minute they got access to your Nominet account via the Online Services.

 

[GreyWing]

DM have stated that the current owner is the correct owner and the fact that the whois was incorrect is their fault.

What would everyone have preferred DM to do? Update the whois themselves or delete and re-register the domain in the correct details (running the risk another catcher caught it in the meantime)?

The end result would have been the same, the current owner would still own the domain...

GDG: I'm guessing that once a domain is in the DM control panel the user has the ability to change the e-mail address on the domain which would then allow them to access the domain via their Nominet account. I don't think for one minute they got access to your Nominet account via the Online Services.

They can't get access to Gold's account because the minute they change the email through the DM's control panel, Nom's system set's up a new account with that one name in.

 

[golddiggerguy]

GDG: I'm guessing that once a domain is in the DM control panel the user has the ability to change the e-mail address on the domain which would then allow them to access the domain via their Nominet account. I don't think for one minute they got access to your Nominet account via the Online Services.

Fair enough and yes agreed, heads a little fuzzy at the mo :shock:

All I need is a confirmation that, although DM said on the phone they did some house keeping by correcting the domains details (however they did it) isn't true - I can then go down the nominet route of fraud.

Unless the current owner can correct me and others here and say it wasn't them that changed it either,.... it was DM.

If thats the case then I need to take this down another route rather than just a few calls to a support line and a post to a forum.

Thanks for your replies Matt

Would like to know what the timings are to be able to break the system to allow 2 bookings.

 

[Systreg]

Would like to know what the timings are to be able to break the system to allow 2 bookings.

@ GDG, I think Matt mentioned something to do with that earlier, something along the lines of, if I went to book a name for catching now at DM, in between the time it takes me to check the name and then click the checkout button to book it, somone else can also book the same name at any point before I hit the checkout button.

So, if I checked to see if a name was available to book using the DM system, then went and did something else for minute before clicking checkout, someone else could have also booked the name at the same time, because until I hit the checkout button, it will still show as available to book for anyone else checking to see if it's available, something like that anyway.

 

[cm1975]

Let me get this straight ...

I buy a domain name from say Sedo and use their escrow service to transfer the domain. Everything goes through and I then "own" the domain.

However, I've use the same registrar as the previous owner.

Now some registrars (eg Heart and 123 reg) require an internal transfer of accounts, before it would appear in my account. If this internal transfer does not happen, then the previous owner could still change the admin email and take it back???

 

[GreyWing]

Let me get this straight ...

I buy a domain name from say Sedo and use their escrow service to transfer the domain. Everything goes through and I then "own" the domain.

However, I've use the same registrar as the previous owner.

Now some registrars (eg Heart and 123 reg) require an internal transfer of accounts, before it would appear in my account. If this internal transfer does not happen, then the previous owner could still change the admin email and take it back???

Correct.....

 

[cm1975]

Correct.....

Blimey!! You think that by going through an Escrow process like that is a huge safeguard and there's (potentially) a bloody big flaw in the system! :shock:

 

[dotNetFreak]

They can't get access to Gold's account because the minute they change the email through the DM's control panel, Nom's system set's up a new account with that one name in.

I hit submit before actually finishing the post - I've added the other bit in on whether people feel DM should have left the whois as it was and simply moved the domain into GDG's account, but I'm guessing it had already been moved off their tag by then so they couldn't do anything anyhow...

I knew the new owner wouldn't have got access to GDG's own account, but did forget it would have set up a new account rather than being able to be merged into their existing Nominet account due to the registrant differences.

and yes, I did read it from the start

I'm certainly not condoning the change of e-mail and registrant transfer and do sympathise with Andy, but I feel that if the correct owner, according to the registrar (DM) has possession of the domain then I'm not sure really what anyone is going to do about it...

 

[GreyWing]

I'm certainly not condoning the change of e-mail and registrant transfer and do sympathise with Andy, but I feel that if the correct owner, according to the registrar (DM) has possession of the domain then I'm not sure really what anyone is going to do about it...

Sorry mate for a minute from reading your post I thought that you thought GDG was the second owner, that's what the comment was about which I removed shortly after.

As for what someone is going to do about it, I think someone might be getting a call from the old bill if it isn't resolved very quickly. Someone has obtained goods by deception, my bet is this name will be back with GDG within a few days.

 

[golddiggerguy]

If you were in my shoes, put aside how I get it...

What would YOU want from all of this?

1. The domain
2. The domain and costs
3. The domain, costs and a name and shame with a public whipping
4. The domain, cost ................... you get the idea

Thinking about this, I would have never have known if I say had 25+ domains to check, was busy or away and didn't check on the drop day to see the domain registered under my name.

I know what I am going to do and will pushing the right buttons in the right order tomorrow.

Thanks for all your help upto now and do hope this doesn't happen again.

 

[dotNetFreak]

As for what someone is going to do about it, I think someone might be getting a call from the old bill if it isn't resolved very quickly. Someone has obtained goods by deception, my bet is this name will be back with GDG within a few days.

I accept the method by which the whois has been corrected is dodgy at best, but if the genuinely correct owner (according to DM) is now listed on the whois I can't see anything being done about it.

If it hadn't been for an automated system all DM would have had to do was to ring Nominet, sign an indemity and they would have changed the whois to the current owner. Alternatively they could have simply deleted the domain and re-registered it with the correct details.

Whether something is done about it we'll have to wait and see, my gut feeling is at the end of the day Nominet will ask the registrar who the correct owner should be, DM will say the current owner and that will be that...

Perhaps a slap on the wrist for the current owner from Nominet for transferring the domain in the manner that they did and for not contacting DM to correct it for them.

Andy - I hope I'm wrong mate!

 

[rob]

Simple fact is that is that however much DM screwed up the 'current' registrant contravened Nominets T&C by changing the domain admin email address and transferring the domain to themselves when they were NOT the rightful owner.

At most the 'current' owner is owed the backorder fee back, and at best DM should try and buy the domain from the rightful owner once it's transferred back to him via Nominet.

It's simply not acceptable for DM to say that they screwed up and really the right person got the domain in the end. Wrong. Once the domain is registered into a registrant's name the ONLY persons with the rightful permissions to transfer the domain are Nominet and the registrant on the whois. Period. No exceptions.

S

This this and more this.

And this again.


I hope domainmonster take a lead in sorting this out, and Nominet reverse any fraudulent transfers.

 

[retired_member16]

So, in conclusion.

No one should use Domain Monster. I had never heard of them anyway.

Every person on Acorn who buys or sells domains should have their own tag.

The domain in question should be mentioned here, so we can all take a look and then move onto something else.

 

[golddiggerguy]

I have called and emailed Nominet again and will wait the fate of the domain with a reply.

Removed this line - As I now have been told by current owner Domain Monster had changed the admin email and details not the current owner?!*!

I'm going with what ever legally is right and what ever will be, .....will be.

 

[gimpydog]

As much as I like DM and still use I was concerned one time when they renewed one of my domains when it was suspended because they had a new owner lined up.

....ditto that


Could some of these issues be addressed if Nominet sent an automatic email to the registrant (at the old admin email address) whenever whois admin details are amended?

Last year someone changed the postal address on one of my builing society accounts & I would never have known if the bs hadn't sent me a letter confirming the new details to the old (my real) address.