Beginners Luck or failure ?

[Edwin]

Really great summary, Systreg.

One mistake that I often see beginners making is to rush in and register lots of names. Don't you think that we'd have registered them first, if they were worth having? Some of us have been in the industry over a decade, and we're registering stuff every single day.

That's not to say that it's impossible to find names worth registering, only that it should be REALLY HARD. So if after 5 minutes you've got a list of 50 names to register, you're going about it all wrong! There's no way that you'll ever find even a fraction of that number per hour. In fact, if I'm in the domain hunting mood I'm really happy if I can find 3 or 4 to register after an hour's sustained research, and that's despite the fact that I know EXACTLY what to look for.

Owning 100 names that have no value isn't an achievement, it's just like owning 100 losing lottery tickets to yesterday's draw. But owning just 1 decent name that has value is a real first step on a long and potentially profitable road!

 

[Edwin]

To illustrate what I am talking about...

I just plucked a subject out of the air about an hour ago: dj equipment.

I don't know anything about it, but I did a bit of digging by looking at eBay and a few ecommerce sites, made a list of keywords and checked what was available.

After throwing away some less desirable terms (cross-referenced with Google Keyword tool, the ads appearing against the terms on Google, and Google shopping listings), I was left with the following 6 domains that I just registered. None of them will make me millions, but each is specific to a particular product (some are quite high value products in fact), descriptive (no trademarks or product names) and they're all "in with a chance" as far as an eventual sale is concerned...

hazemachine/co/uk
hazer/co/uk
mixeramp/co/uk
mixeramps/co/uk
mixeramplifier/co/uk
mixeramplifiers/co/uk

 

[aZooZa]

Edwin -- always selfless and helpful. An industry star.

 

[accelerator]

hi anyone got an idea on price rough idea

choiceisyours.co.uk Online
whatdoyoupay.co.uk Online

I would agree with Edwin and say these domains do not have any value. Here are some domains from my portfolio that I would say do:

headupdisplay.co.uk - exact generic domain, emerging technology

jethire.co.uk - nice and short, short generic term, relates to a valuable service that can be advertised online

Valuable domains match to generic terms that relate to valuable goods and services that can be bought / advertised online.

Rgds

 

[deconstruction]

Great advice from Edwin.

I have bought very few names this year as i am spening alot of time developing some sites. But i have been meaning to have a quick look and see if there are still good names about to reg. I had a quick look at DJ Equipment after seeing this post, and bought mp3mixers.co.uk.

Not huge searches, but solid each month, would apear to be the direction djing is moving in (out with cds in with mp3s). The equipment seems to be worth quite a bit of money.

So the names are there, but like Edwin said "dont rush in", i know its hard (i think we all did it when we started).

There is a wealth of information on this forum and peoples blogs.

 

[Edwin]

BTW, you may find things a bit easier if you treat the domain name registration process like a very, very, very strict beauty contest.

Absolutely ANY REASON AT ALL is enough to kick a contestant (candidate domain) out. Don't even stop to think about the logic too carefully, anything that triggers even the smallest hint of concern and that candidate domain is history!

Not sure the keyword tool's accurate? OUT
No advertisers against the term? OUT
Too few searches? OUT
Product will never be sold online? OUT
Product with only 1-2 manufacturers who between them own the whole market (people will find them anyway, without the generic)? OUT
Not the main keyword/keyphrase for the product or service in question? OUT
Not an exact match for a commercial product/service? OUT
Too many adjectives (colour/material/texture/weight etc. i.e. greenW, paperX, roughY, heavyZ where W-Z are the keywords...)? OUT
and so on, and so on.

Basically, it's like panning for gold in a river. You take a deep dredge of sand from the bottom of the river, and you start swirling it in the pan, then you tip away NEARLY ALL of the sediment, add more water, swirl again. You tip away NEARLY ALL the remaining sediment, add more water, swirl again. Repeat until your arms ache and you might - just perhaps - have a glint of gold the size of a pinhead in the bottom of the pan.

Same with domain names.

 

[websaway]

Don't register names you either can't develop or hold onto for at least five to ten years. Don't fall into the trap that a domain cost's $5 it's going to cost you $100 or more over it's life. If you register 200 domains a year ( 4 a week )for 6 years you end up with 1200 domains costing you a small fortune and if the quality or longevity is questionable it can end up being an expensive learning process.

 

[retired_member26]

<Either a domain name is worth in excess of its registration fee, or it’s worth NOTHING. Period.>

Correctversion:

<Either a domain name is worth in (excess of its registration fee - regfee), or it’s worth -regfee (negative the regfee you wasted on it. Period.>

I hate self-proclaimed gurus writing blogs.

 

[stevebrowne]

One thing I would add is to use the keyword tools with numbers AS A GUIDE. If you are looking for new markets and new areas that you have researched, discovered or know about via other means, then there simply may not be any searches. This doesn't make a domain valueless, it just makes it an unknown quantity.

Sometimes you can see that the global figures are VERY high but the local aren't, as a product may not have made it to the UK yet.

But they might be slightly bigger gambles.

 

[kierongibbs]

Hi thanks for the advice if you do find a good name would you say i should stick to .co.uk or would you say invest in the .com as well you mentioned you bought the mp3 domain.co.uk would you have gone for the .com as well

Great advice from Edwin.

I have bought very few names this year as i am spening alot of time developing some sites. But i have been meaning to have a quick look and see if there are still good names about to reg. I had a quick look at DJ Equipment after seeing this post, and bought mp3mixers.co.uk.

Not huge searches, but solid each month, would apear to be the direction djing is moving in (out with cds in with mp3s). The equipment seems to be worth quite a bit of money.

So the names are there, but like Edwin said "dont rush in", i know its hard (i think we all did it when we started).

There is a wealth of information on this forum and peoples blogs.

 

[kierongibbs]

can anyone tell me if its a good idea to buy a domain name with 2 products in lets say cdsdvds.com or cddvd.com: The Leading DVDs Site on the Net or does this become useless when you combine

 

[Edwin]

Useless, if you're buying to sell. If you're buying strictly to develop, and both products naturally complement each other, then there might be some SEO value.

 

[aZooZa]

<Either a domain name is worth in excess of its registration fee, or it’s worth NOTHING. Period.>

Correctversion:

<Either a domain name is worth in (excess of its registration fee - regfee), or it’s worth -regfee (negative the regfee you wasted on it. Period.>

I hate self-proclaimed gurus writing blogs.

I hate self-proclaimed writers writing rubbish. In fact turnic, you're a wucking fanker and I don't like you too well. Let me know if my comment isn't clear enough won't you?

Yours,

Atatürk

 

[accelerator]

Hi thanks for the advice if you do find a good name would you say i should stick to .co.uk or would you say invest in the .com as well you mentioned you bought the mp3 domain.co.uk would you have gone for the .com as well

The .com is often worth buying, it is the web's premier extension. Most of the time though, I find it's already taken. It depends whether you want to concentrate on .co.uk purely or go for a multi-extension strategy. Personally I buy domains based on keywords, most of the time I'd love to get the .com but I end up with a .net, .tv or even .me.

Rgds

 

[retired_member26]

.........

I'll tell you something: I wish I lived in the UK. You know what I mean, won't you? Or Anyway if I ever come to the UK let me see you for a chat!

Dalai Lama

 

[philipp]

Just ignore him, there's a handy function to do it from your control panel.

P.

 

[julian]

Kieron don't worry too much what this lot say - you have to understand your dealing with extreme 'hardcore' domainers, of which nothing less than 'loans.com' or some other super premium generic or product related domain will do..

If you want to punt £25 on few 'brandable' domains then go ahead don't let them get you down - just be careful.

For example you may find that you never make anything out of ChoiceIsYours.co.uk, but just because some think its gash, you never know - park it at sedo and someone could offer £100 for it one day becuase they want it as a brand for their new site.. i've seen a hell of a lot worse sold here..


good luck

 

[Edwin]

Julian, you're not helping with that kind of comment. There's absolutely no reason to approach domaining "the wrong way" when "the right way" is just a question of doing a bit of reading and a bit of learning.

Already in the opening post, Kieron said he'd registered 15 domains. That's potentially £100 thrown away right there. Domaining gets very expensive very quickly if you don't know what you're doing.

As we're trying hard to explain, it is possible NOW to still register domains that have commercial value, you just have to put in the effort and do the research in the right way.

Even in 2009, there's no need to fall back on "brandables" - better to spend the money on buying 100 lottery tickets (2 a week for a year) - the return's so much higher if you win (and the probability's likely to be higher too)!

If you want to find a product domain, for example, go to eBay.co.uk and browse the category view All Categories

Then pick a category, sort all the auctions by price (highest value first) and start looking for keyphrases in the titles of the auctions.

Mentally throw away ALL brand names, model numbers, extra description and anything that's not generic, and you should be left just with "clean" keyphrases.

Then check them on Google Keyword tool (in "Exact" mode) https://adwords.google.co.uk/select/KeywordToolExternal and you should be able to find a subset which are worth considering. Then check your list to see if any are available in .co.uk.

NexTag - Compare Prices Before You Buy is another good place to hunt. Click down into any category, and you'll see a "Popular Searches" box at the foot of the left-hand column. That gives some product ideas.

The other way to start looking is to search on Google for: "all products" KEYWORD site:.co.uk

For example: "all products" gardening site:.co.uk

And you'll find lots of ecommerce sites in the UK which have a list of all the products they offer on one page. Look down that list for keyphrase ideas, again throwing away all the excess (brand names, qualifiers (large, green, small, compact, etc.), model numbers and so on)

That's how I find a lot of my stuff. I quite often don't know ANYTHING about the topic, but it still works!

 

[RSK3000]

Kieron, I don't know how much you know about Edwin but he certainly is NOT a self proclaimed guru, as someone suggested. He is in fact a very successful retailer of domains to businesses.

Edwin was interviewed recently about his work and I suggest you have a listen to the interview, on the OzDomainer website, here - Domain Names Podcast Episode 12 with Edwin Hayward MemorableDomains.co.uk | Domain Names - Domain Name News - Domain Names Podcast | OzDomainer.com

turnic - while it is wrong that you were verbally abused I have to admit I was close to writing a strongly worded response to you myself. Your comment was not helpful, badly timed and its wrong to criticise Edwin, who is simply sharing his advice with others when I'm sure his time could be spent more profitably, elsewhere.

Kieron, once you have spent a long time studying domain sales you will see which brandables might have a chance of selling, so in that sense julian is right. However, as has been pointed out they are best avoided, in my opinion, at least to begin with.

I would seriously reconsider the domains in your portfolio in the light of what has been written here. Never become emotionally attached to a domain either. If its not got a resale value or you cannot profitably develop it I would get rid of it.

 

[kierongibbs]

thanks Edwin thanks Julian all help advice is wanted and most appreciated i have just set up a new site online buisness for my partner in the equestrian world which a web guru has created and this has led to my interest in this, last week i won £500 on a scratch card and thought who cares buy some domains test the water lol, so i guess nothing lost but experience gained. Ithink im starting to get a clearer view he says laughing to himself and dont worry i havent ordered the new car after checking my domains on domtastic yet. I dont have any webpage or site building experience a friend does all of mine but charges if i did want to buy...eventually a name and you guys reassured me it was a half decent name what would you reccomend doing with it considering this is a hobbie just for fun would you see if i could flip ity turn it from £5 to £50 on sedo or some where or is there something i should be doing if it is something good, once again thanks for all the help and your patience