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New Nominet Policy to Kill Drop Catching

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Following up from my comments that I feel I'd prefer to see one Registry appointed auction service operating at arms length from any Registrar, or even operated entirely by the Registry, take control of all domain names that expire rather than letting individual Registrars do as they please with them, what do others think? If all potentially valuable expired but yet to be deleted domain names are going to be auctioned, wouldn't it be better for everyone if they all went through this process via one independent service? The associated Registrar could still get a large percentage of the sale price but they would be kept at arms length from any bidders. This would also mean that any really good domain names had to be auctioned first rather than potentially "sold" to an offshoot company owned by the Registrar to be "marketed".

In summary my proposal means:

1. All domain names are auctioned once expired. If no bid is received the domain name drops as now.
2. Auctions are independent of any Registrar that might have a vested interest in the auction. This keeps the auctions transparent and prevents those with deep pockets (probably some domainers! ;)) colluding with Registrars beforehand to get first dibs at the best expiring domain names before they go to auction and Registrars cherry picking the best names to be siphoned off to their own offshoot companies.

This seems highly sensible Invincible and something I would back if any changes are to be made from the current system.

Imagine registrar's having a nice name and it coming up for renewal, let's say debt.co.uk for example.

If the registrar has any financial interest in letting this go to auction, renewals emails might go a miss, renewal requests fall off the system so names don't get renewed (already happens now with some registrars). Imagine all the mistakes that registrars currents currently make and look at them in the new light that they make money from some of these mistakes in the future. There is going to be carnage and suspicion all over the place. It doesn't really matter if their is skulduggery involved, the suspicion will do the damage to the industry.

So if it is going to be done it needs to be run independently as Invincible says and by the Registry Nominet.
 
It is unlikely that another body will arise to auction off domains, again this puts Nominets effectiveness into question.

The UK market should not be wanting to grow up to become that of the TLDs, the UK should be setting the standards for the rest of the world to follow. Simply hanging on to the coat tails of ICANN and Verisign is not something that should be seen to aspire to.

Nothing should be inevitable, but I suppose when you have the likes of SEDO on the board at Nominet I suppose it should be expected.

The little guys however make up the brunt of the membership, but they are not making their voice heard.

I am all for a fair marketplace, however I do not believe the current proposals to be fair. I would support a Nominet Commissioned auction service as at least it would be fair. I would also support domain owners opting into an auction on expiry of a domain, provided that a share of the sale price was on the table.

Don't get me wrong I love capitalism but it must be achieved and not simply handed on a silver plate which is what is going to happen.
 
Can't spot declarations of interest on there, or does that come under stuff I don't need to know :)

These people were on the policy group:-

Gordon Moir, Webb Henderson
Ghazala Ahmed, Markmonitor
Tania Baumann, Nominet
Andrew Bennett, Whoisearch
Eleanor Bradley, Nominet
Hugo Dalrymple-Smith, Sedo
Theo Docherty, Com Laude
Leanne Kenny, Nominet
Matt Mansell, Domainmonster
Claire Milne, Antelope Consulting
Alex Monaghan, Monaghan Consultants Ltd
Phil Rushton, British Telecommunications plc
Lynnette Brady, Markmonitor
Andrew Cormack, JANET(UK)
Hayath Hussein, Com Laude
Phil Bowles, Office of Fair Trading
 
Yes have seen that list. Doesnt answer the question though... ;)
 
Rob,

I don't recall a specific declaration of interests, each person's company affiliation was made public http://www.nominet.org.uk/digitalAssets/56274_List_of_issue_group_participants.pdf, so I guess the informed can put 2 & 2 together.

The important thing to remember is the deadline, get the feedback submitted so it can be presented at the meetings, anything not on paper can't be taken into account. Feel free to drop me an email as well, I'm happy to feed any drop catch specific concerns into the discussion (I've already put my cards on the table as a catcher as well as a small business registrar).
 
If the proposals go through substantially unchanged, then those with high value holdings (which could be a single "debt.co.uk" domain or a huge portfolio or anywhere in between) would be well advised to become their own registrar. That way they're only dealing with Nominet and can be sure of receiving renewal notifications, not losing control of their name early via the back door etc. I wonder how many of the larger Registrars who supported these radical changes put 2 and 2 together that far?
 
If the proposals go through substantially unchanged, then those with high value holdings (which could be a single "debt.co.uk" domain or a huge portfolio or anywhere in between) would be well advised to become their own registrar. That way they're only dealing with Nominet and can be sure of receiving renewal notifications, not losing control of their name early via the back door etc. I wonder how many of the larger Registrars who supported these radical changes put 2 and 2 together that far?

I thought that, and its one of a couple of benefits for smaller registrars that is out there if the change occurred.

Another benefit would be the exposure of priced names to 'the masses' which might educate people to the value of domains rather than them being 'worth a fiver'.

Despite this, I think the idea of registrars running the auction as being too 'close'.

Where is the incentive? Renewal for pence per year, or flog off a domain for say £25 base? :)
 
On the proposals themselves... I believe it's far too late for an appeal to retain the status quo (too much to ask given the massive changes outlined) so the best that can be aimed for is a less outlandish compromise.

A) Registrars MUST provide renewal alerts
B) Auctions run by Nominet or a centralised single 3rd party on Nominet's behalf - funds could go to boost the work of the Nominet Trust (remember at this point it's about presenting an alternative that "beats" the stark choice of the new system, not the old)
C) A small % of the sale price (and capped to disincentivise "losing" renewal notices) would go to the Registrar that held the name prior to it expiring on a successful auction. For example 5% and capped at £100/name) That provides some compensation for the added complexity of the new system (and even a small amount could be much higher than the original profit they turned on the domain registration) This would be deposited to the balance of their Nominet account against future registrations/renewals.
D) No automatic parking. There's no reason why ANYONE (original registrant, Nominet/Nominet Trust, Registrar, potential new owner post-auction) should see themselves in jeopardy because of the potential of TM can of worms opened up by parking
 
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Notwithstanding the fact that registrars might have more incentives to screw you, anybody who relies on courtesy reminders from the registrar is going to lose domains one day - and maybe deserves it :(
 
Notwithstanding the fact that registrars might have more incentives to screw you, anybody who relies on courtesy reminders from the registrar is going to lose domains one day - and maybe deserves it :(

Surely that's only because the current system is too lenient at defining how Registrars (that service 3rd party clients) must fulfil their obligations to notify the registrant?
 
I'm not sure I'm reading this the same as you guys, the document suggests a domain can be auctioned, the thread seems to suggest that it will be auctioned by default. Some registrars already park & auction names due to their T&C's.

If you have strong feelings, please put pen to paper and let Nominet know. I've fed back what I can when I can both initially and at the meetings.
 
No matter what new system is put in place, the days of catching the best (of what's left to drop) will end. Frankly it's about time, and as much as I have little respect for Nominet personally, this move is a good one, and has been a long time coming.

I really can't see what people are irked about, most have had it good for years, and have nice protfolios, it's only fair the rest of the population has a better chance of going for the better domains now.

In fact, it is likely to add to the perception that domains are valuable 'items' to buy, so it could help some of you flog some of your current stocks.

I imagine the big registrars might have been hoping something like this would come along ever since the Nominet restructuring took place.
 
Anthony, I don't think it really comes down to simplistic drop catching days being gone, this is more of a case of who controls those domains and who controls the UK namespace.

Giving registrars this sort of Nectar could potentially cause all sorts of issues for registrants, not only that it dilutes the effectiveness and credibility of Nominet.

I note SEDO are involved and I suspect they are all ready in the process of negotiating deals with the large registrars to take over the auction process and monetisation of expired names.

Having employees from SEDO on the Nominet board is akin to having a wolf as a sheep dog.

Whether catching is dead or not does not affect our own long term plans, however I am disappointed that instead of Nominet addressing the issues that DynaDot and others have brought in, and as they are somewhat questionably against Nominets own Terms, I am surprised at this recent suggestion to make it official while also taking it a step forward.
 
Whatever happens, I would agree that the playing field should be level and the same process should ideally follow whoever you registered the domain with.
 
Looking at the proposed chart, the original registrant is entitled to renew the domain right up to the cancellation day (as it is at present). If it is renewed and been auctioned off how is the auction participant going to feel? How can you sell something that actually hasn't been given full clear title?

On the above grounds of original registrant renewal rights, stages
"Registrar may auction the domain name" & "Registrant admin contact details replaced by registrar contact details" is nonsense (even illegal).
 
Every time this invincible guy pops up I know that drop catchers would be screwed!

As Monaghan said write your comment and submit it! Do not listen this invincible's comments. He talks as if the proposed shit was in place. That Policy group document is designed to kill drop catchers. It is so obvious.

There is an existing drop catching system which has been evolved for years. What is the reason to abolish it now? If you are a good programmer and have the required hardware come and play. Nominet tries to get rid of us since we always force them to stay awake in terms of EPP, DAC, Whois etc.

Bastards...
 
I think Invincible is being pretty much spot on with this. I don't think he is saying what he wants to see, only what is possible to recover a bad situation that it appears drop catching to be in.

Nom seem to have decided to get rid of dropcatching and it's time to decide what you want to see in it's place. From my experience of Nom, if it has got this far then there is no going back regardless of what you write to them. You might be able to shape a little the new system but the old one is well and truly gone.
 
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