New members, quantity over quality?

[bonusmedia]

I'm here regularly anyway to check if there's anything worth buying. This is probably irrational and more about fear of missing out than actually a good use of time.
I suppose there is also something reassuring about the familiar, especially when working alone/remotely

I did get annoyed - my own fault for breaking the cardinal 'no religion or politics' rule.
In truth the referendum result kiboshed the deal I was working on (international buyers spooked) so I've altered my strategy and I've been more conscious of wasting time.

 

[DomainManage]

@Adam H
Yes under the radar is an understatement. This forum has a mix of very clued up tech savvy entrepreneurs and technology professionals, with vast range of skill sets. I don't think there are many other UK, tech/web forums that come close to being able to offer advice on such a broad range of subjects (take a look at warrior forum if you want to be spoon-fed drivel by gung-ho newbs). I think that most members here who fit the above description are probably of the more mature ilk are generally happy to keep a low profile because they have nothing to prove.

 

[ian]

@Adam H
Yes under the radar is an understatement. This forum has a mix of very clued up tech savvy entrepreneurs and technology professionals, with vast range of skill sets. I don't think there are many other UK, tech/web forums that come close to being able to offer advice on such a broad range of subjects (take a look at warrior forum if you want to be spoon-fed drivel by gung-ho newbs). I think that most members here who fit the above description are probably of the more mature ilk are generally happy to keep a low profile because they have nothing to prove.

This is a valid point; the remit of those more seasoned individuals stretches beyond just domains. I'd like to think of myself in that category, I've helped my fellow domainers privately on all sorts of topics from starting a business, to security, to accounting and personal taxes, but I guess I do like to kick up dust from time to time.

Just to point out my thread wasn't to poke holes in this forum, I visit daily and would miss it if not around, but my overall concern at the quality of new members, and whether certain markets are being targetted to bring them in, as I'm not sure it is the correct approach.

 

[atlas]

Without that rule my guess is you would get 1 or 2 'nice domain' comments and 10 or 20 arguments as to why it's not worth the asking price

Let's try it: http://www.acorndomains.co.uk/threads/dandelion-co-uk.143358/

Apparently I have insufficient privileges to comment on your thread... perhaps it's only open to exclusive members?

 

[atlas]

In my opinion there doesn't appear to have been any significant investment in quality/relevant content by the new owner ....

... when I don't see them continually investing in good quality content...

Specifically, what sort of content do you have in mind?

 

[Pierre Barnard]

Hi guys,

Good discussion. As a new member here, I would like to share my viewpoint. After reading through this thread, I have to agree with most seasoned members here, the forum is not very active, and although I do not necessarily find it hostile, my perception is that it is very "clinical" for the lack of a better word.

As a new domainer in general, I like to participate in discussions, appraisals and so forth, hence I find the community at Namepros more engaging and try to "give back" to the community where I can. My thread here aims to prove that point.

Although I haven't been domining for years and years, I am very passionate about it and try to learn as much as I can, and also dont mind if someone corrects me, that is the only way to learn. Yes, I have posted some "bad" domains on here, but normally in the Bargain Bin area and I have also made my #8 sale in DomainLore, so I think with a little more experience, I will some day master this "beast" that is UK domaining

Have a great Friday!

 

[atlas]

Have a look on NamePros at the kind of thing the writers write about.

Are you referring to the blog?

 

[ian]

This conversation is going to be had again and again and again over the coming year in my opinion. @Bailey was trying it a week or two ago and now @ian. It can't be denied, despite @ian semi back-pedalling. It's a shell of its former self. We wouldn't be having these conversations if it wasn't on the minds of forum members. Look back over threads to the days of Alan and see for yourselves. I am saying what I see and so are other people when they say this forum is mostly a sales venue now. If members are happy with that, I'll be quite happy with that because I can discuss other domain name topics elsewhere if need be. If members aren't, what do those members want to do or be done about it?

No back-pedalling here, I said from the first post that I have nothing against the forum itself, just the influx of new members that offer no value, just spam, and asking how the forum are targetting these new members, if at all. The forum does just fine, though as we all know, is lacking any real content that we can all discuss and relate to. Maybe part of the problem is certain members making snide remarks at any comment made; I'm a victim of this myself by a few, though no idea why as I've had no prior dealings with them. Maybe it is the same for some of the old guard.

@Pierre Barnard - I was thinking as I wrote the original post that you were the only one that came to mind that started off in a similar way, but has progressed, taken on board what has been said and developed with it. Most don't.

 

[Edwin]

The harsh reality is that people aren't going to come into the domain industry in 2016 and make a success of it with no background or experience. Not in large enough numbers to water down the flood of hopeful-but-hapless newbies.

And yes, we were all newbies once - but the market then isn't the market now! It's foolish to pretend that there's still some huge goldmine of domains just waiting to be discovered by the first person to muster a rusty old pickaxe and swing at the virgin rockface. If the stuff was any good, it would already have been mined.

Yes, the drops provide a tiny dribble of gold-ish, but it's not enough - not nearly enough - to sustain the number of newbies coming into the domain industry.

Why? Because it only takes a get-rich-quick dream, 30 seconds and a credit card to become a "domain investor".

And that means that almost all newbies will not be net contributors to this forum - ever. The rare exceptions aren't enough to dramatically change that.

 

[martin-s]

For me, the most interesting threads on this forum are about developing domains rather that just buying and selling them.

I like that it's a UK-centric forum and there's a variety of expertise on here that is rare to find elsewhere. Dig beneath the surface a bit and there's a surprising number of people doing some really interesting things.

Yes, the place can feel unfriendly to newbies who are learning the lessons most of us already have, but it's probably right that the forum polices itself.

The new threads list does fill up with a lot of crap too - the same old domains listed for offers over and over, and junk 'bargains' most of us wouldn't touch. But I'm still interested enough to check through for hidden gems. One man's junk is another man's treasure.

Most people will learn pretty quickly where they are wasting their time - even if there are one or two notable exceptions!

Ultimately not everyone will hang around when they realise that domains are harder than they thought. But new blood is a good thing, and the people that do hang around can only add to the value of the place.

 

[Admin]

The problem is that it's not a discussion form anymore, it's a classifieds site.

For a discussion forum about domains, there's a remarkable amount of restrictions on actually discussing domains.

Interesting. Would you mind elaborating, what restrictions do you think we should remove and I'll consider it. I can't think of anything other than the one that says don't bash a sales thread.

 

[Edwin]

There is a restriction on discussing the value of domains belonging to other people (at least, there always was) and I think that's a very good thing. When the domain owner has absolutely zero control over the topic, why should they be subjected to a bunch of strangers opining on record (Google never really forgets) about the worth - or lack of worth - of their pride and joy?

(To be clear, I'm not talking about the appraisals forum threads, which are specific and explicitly solicited exceptions to the above. I'm talking about discussing the value and merits of random domain XYZ.co.uk where XYZ.co.uk doesn't belong to the person discussing it - and where the owner may not even be an Acorn member.)

 

[Edwin]

For me, the most interesting threads on this forum are about developing domains rather that just buying and selling them.

I like that it's a UK-centric forum and there's a variety of expertise on here that is rare to find elsewhere. Dig beneath the surface a bit and there's a surprising number of people doing some really interesting things.

Yes, the place can feel unfriendly to newbies who are learning the lessons most of us already have, but it's probably right that the forum polices itself.

The new threads list does fill up with a lot of crap too - the same old domains listed for offers over and over, and junk 'bargains' most of us wouldn't touch. But I'm still interested enough to check through for hidden gems. One man's junk is another man's treasure.

Most people will learn pretty quickly where they are wasting their time - even if there are one or two notable exceptions!

Ultimately not everyone will hang around when they realise that domains are harder than they thought. But new blood is a good thing, and the people that do hang around can only add to the value of the place.

But don't you find there's a nagging feeling of "here we go again"?

Basically, everything that anyone needs to make a success of domaining (IF it's possible to do so from scratch in 2016, which is a big IF) has already been posted on here and elsewhere, usually not just once, but many, many, many times before.

So threads that help newbies are only really surfacing information that already exists and perhaps putting it into slightly different words or condensing it. But none of it is new or even newish.

An alternative would be for newbies to actually read older threads. Wow! It really is as simple as that. When it comes to the basics, everything they could possibly want to know about domains has already been written...

I would guess that's at least one of the reasons why many forum regulars have drifted away over the years. When you see the same questions asked for the sixth or the sixtieth time, it gets very old fast!

 

[Admin]

Edwin, you are against discussion in sales threads and ask why should it be allowed..

There is a restriction on discussing the value of domains belonging to other people (at least, there always was) and I think that's a very good thing. When the domain owner has absolutely zero control over the topic, why should they be subjected to a bunch of strangers opining on record (Google never really forgets) about the worth - or lack of worth - of their pride and joy?

(To be clear, I'm not talking about the appraisals forum threads, which are specific and explicitly solicited exceptions to the above. I'm talking about discussing the value and merits of random domain XYZ.co.uk where XYZ.co.uk doesn't belong to the person discussing it - and where the owner may not even be an Acorn member.)

I think it a valid and lucid argument was put forward by Scott as to why it should be allowed... this might be something to put to a poll

The no discussions in domain name sales threads is ridiculous. I know this rule has been in place for a long time but when I first joined Acorn, it wasn't enforced and some really fascinating discussions ensued (and I bet more sales were made because of it).

If I was an outsider coming to this forum and saw that you couldn't comment or ask questions on sales threads then the warning signals would start to ring. Why not? What have you got to hide? Why do we have to discuss it by PM? Why won't you commit to discussing something in public? Am I going to get scammed?

 

[monaghan]

Not sure of the options available in the software, but could we have an option to discuss sales threads in a non-indexed section of the site? This would allow legitimate questions & comment without the worry of value discussions showing on Google.

 

[Edwin]

I am not talking about sales threads. I am talking about threads involving domains that don't belong to the thread starter at all. (A sales thread, by definition, is about a domain owned by the first poster in the thread).

It would be a terrible idea to allow discussion about random domains i.e. just whatever domain any poster felt they wanted to talk about.

For example, if I own XYZ.co.uk but have NEVER posted about it on here or elsewhere, I would be very, very annoyed to find a thread with people talking about the value - or lack of it - of XYZ.co.uk. That's none of anyone's business!

If I ask for appraisals, then it's 100% fair game.

If I posted it for sale, then maybe there's a case to allow comments. Though that is likely to turn very nasty very fast, it's human nature.

But if I didn't post it at all, then it shouldn't be discussable, period.

I'm making this point now specifically because the discussion is turning towards possibly allowing more leniency around the discussion of particular domains, so I wanted to nip the issue in the bud.

 

[scottmccloud]

It would be a terrible idea to allow discussion about random domains i.e. just whatever domain any poster felt they wanted to talk about.

IT'S A DOMAIN NAME DISCUSSION FORUM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Edwin]

IT'S A DOMAIN NAME DISCUSSION FORUM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

You don't generally find people bantering about the value of a neighbour's property on a property forum. The discussions are around the value of one's own house (if you're thinking of putting it up for sale) or around the value of one you've seen for sale. But there aren't thread after thread about houses that aren't on the market at all and whose owners have made no indication they want to put them on the market.

Yes, Zoopla etc. will provide an "estimated value" for any property, just like Estibot will for any domain. But that's very very different from having people actively discuss a particular not-for-sale property.

 

[ian]

Hmmm, tricky one. If you take cars for example, such as the one I own, the car forums are rife with opinions on the value of them, to be point where the thread has now passed 150 pages worth of argument, not just about the car in general, but specific cars of owners who haven't asked for them to be discussed; I have no issue with this, so the same has to be said for domains I guess. However, I'm not a fan of discussion taking place on someone's 'for sale' thread (unless the seller doesn't mind)...if they want to discuss, take it to another part of the forum. Maybe all 'for sale' and 'wanted' threads can have an option to "allow discussion about this domain" you have to untick to prevent?

 

[Admin]

Forum was going downhill when Alan finally saw how it could become and was motivated to sell it within 48 hours of his last post within that thread. Alan hasn't been heard from since and approximately 48 hours after his last post we had a new owner who adopted the Alan's former "admin" username so it's forever been confusing given two people have shared one username.

It was sensible to take some time to consider the migration to XenForo and the forum is larger better for it. However the introduction of unrelated advertising, particular the ecig and streamTV stuff at the footer, is quite downmarket. In my opinion there doesn't appear to have been any significant investment in quality/relevant content by the new owner and the addition of The Bar was an additional unwelcome distraction from the main reason most of us are supposedly here. The end result is as we see it now. I am happy to post here, as I have done on many recent occasions, and have written some quite in-depth posts about managed/premium DNS and zone files, but I am now also delighted to be contributing elsewhere which is satisfying enough. I have no shares in the ownership of this forum (nor do I wish for any) and the reason that I currently choose not to pay a membership fee is because I don't sell domain names here, but simply contribute free content out of enjoyment. I could begin to wonder whether my being here is simply lining someone else's pockets when I don't see them continually investing in good quality content (the cost of the hosting and the upgrade to Xenforo doesn't count as continually investing in my opinion because that's not too expensive and was long overdue). If one doesn't intend to continually invest, don't expect others to do it for free. I think that's perfectly reasonable.

I think the ridiculous post and thread editing should stop because of the reasons I have detailed elsewhere, except when the original poster edits their own posts to some degree.

Simply put, if you don't like it you're welcome to write some good content for free and see where it gets you or go elsewhere and write it. The improvements need to come from further up.

These threads are always the best .

@invincible You could avoid the non-helpful derision of this forum David, you set up your own and failed so you know how hard it is. Don't give harmful and derogatory remarks about someone else's, when they are well meaning and you use their forum. Feedback, ideas etc is good but if you want to criticise my decisions on advertising (those ads are businesses of members here!) and forum creation then you can do the right thing and message me privately if you have to get it off your chest. Speculating about Alan is bang out of order too. You don't know anything of what happened, if you want to ... ask me. Timing was everything, I never even knew about that thread, I enquired to Alan around that time and that is it. Why on earth are you criticising my use of 'admin' publicily? What confusion do you have, I cannot possibly imagine. And no you have not heard from Alan but I heard from him last week. All of this unpleasant noise and speculation has no place for public posting, especially as you are not asking me, you are just putting your crap talk out there... so full declaration, i may delete it as its not within the forums interests for more and more people to read your inaccurate speculation and derision. Rant over.

Some good points in this thread. It has been mentioned above and I agree that there are some excellent internet entrepreneurs and online business savvy individuals on this forum, I include myself in trying to be one of them. I am not sat here all day looking at Acorn with hours and hours of free time to develop it, unfortunately. Without wishing to brag, I have bought 14 websites in the last year, many from members here. I have bought domains from many of the regular members here. In total I have bought around 700 domains in the last year from Acorn members. I recently hired a prominent member who is highly skilled and experienced with adwords campaign management. There are many talented individuals here with a mix of skills from design, programming, business, IP and of course everything around domaining and doing online business.

My interests as a keen internet entrepreneur take me into many areas and a look at my postings data shows just what an array of subjects we can discuss here. I've posted in recent history about:

- nominet - 2fa, keyword searching domain manager and many other things
- doing end user outreach for domain sales
- escrow
- adsense , page level ads etc etc
- SEO , penguin
- Google Certified shops
- reported a good domain sale
- asking about notable websites uptake/use of .uk
- Wikipedia editor accounts
- asked for advice on the best .com registrars and given my experience of transition from 1 major to another
- LLLL.com valuations
- SEDO and domain parking, domainmanage feedback and experience
- content creation in general, textbroker.co.uk etc

This forum was closed to registrations unless you signed up with a domain email. This had some obvious benefits but stopped most potential domain buyers. I changed this recently which of course has opened us up to easier registrations with gmail addresses. I do my best to deal with spam quickly.

I believe this forum can discuss and share much more information on the subjects around domaining as there are many here who do not just buy/sell domains, that is actually a side business to their online business ventures and we need to share knowledge on the subjects that wrap around this, especially until the 5 years is up on the .UK situation and UK domaining will get a bit more interesting again.