Frank Schilling Increasing New gTLD Prices 3,000%

Edwin · Mar 18, 2017

Most people wouldn't even understand that company.bikes was meant to be a web address if they saw it on a flyer or the side of a van.

The only thing that vaguely rings a bell is the pattern "www.domain.majorextension" where majorextension is .com + the predominant cctld of whatever country we're talking about. In the UK that's of course .co.uk - .uk will probably sorta kinda work but it will still look odd compared to the .co.uk.

Of course if you don't care about SEO or memorability or understandability then you can use whatever junk extension you like - and if you're just the local barber or plumber does it really matter?

But if you count on your domain name in any way, shape or form to actually help bring you business, you'd be wise not to deviate from the pattern I outlined above.

NOTE: .nyc might work at the hyper-local level. I'm not in NY so I can't comment on whether it's widely used and recognised there. But that's still just a more specific version of the pattern. If a new GTLD geo has caught on very strongly in a city, then so long as you only want/need local visitors to your website it might be a perfectly good choice.

.bikes (or .whatever) isn't known in any country or territory. It doesn't fit the pattern. So it's perfectly usable for any business that doesn't care at all, but it's not going to win them business, and it will hurt them if they actually wanted traffic to come from people seeing the domain and typing it in.

Edwin · Mar 18, 2017

Just an extra little comment on .bikes (I know it's just an example, but examples can still be useful)

If you need people to remember company.bikes it might be just as good to have them remember bikes.randomextension. In both cases you're counting on people going out of their comfort zone when it comes to recognising "this is a web address" so there's no extra merit to company.bikes over bikes.someotherextension...

All of the above are poor choices; beyond that, company.bikes is no better than about a hundred bikes.something alternatives (where "something" is a bland extension that doesn't clash with the concept of bikes, like bikes.site or bikes.cc or bikes.to or bikes.abc or bikes.xyz or... ...)

woopwoop · Mar 18, 2017

dog said:
.bikes is not an extension. You've just shown the problem with new gTLDs.

Erm, no. Here's the problem with new gTLDs:

They're late to the game and .com has had a 20+ year head start
People don't know about them
Companies are not widely using them
They're expensive in most cases
The gTLDs that are cheap have been taken over by spammers and scammers
The prices are not guaranteed to be stable which is a risk for investors and end users (this is what this thread should really be highlighting)
There is a group of people who fight against gTLDs because they are scared of the devaluation of their (in most cases crappy) .com portfolio.

Points 1-7 are the main problems with new gTLDs and I really shouldn't have to make this point when you are the one fighting against them probably for the reason in #7.

dog said:
So you believe using fake extensions to prove points helps the new gTLD argument?

The fact that you even see this more of an argument than pros and cons, or event strengths and weaknesses, or risks and rewards, or really what it is... a changing and settling domainscape... shows that you are fixed and reluctant to both change or even consider the possibility of change and you should know that this mindset doesn't work out well for most people.

I'm aware and reflective of the problem with gTLDs (#1-7 above) and also in the potential benefits, post #17 above.

If you choose to ignore the benefits or highlight faux problems, then this just pushes reaffirms you're part of the group I mentioned in point 7 above. Are you ready to share you best .coms?

Edwin · Mar 18, 2017

If I were selling to a single market, I would choose a secondary cctld for that market way, way before something like .bikes.

So in the UK, bikes.org.uk would probably still serve a company 50x better than companyname.bikes would!

woopwoop · Mar 18, 2017

I know that this is a rehash of every other COM vs gTLD debate, but I think that we have to understand the premises. For me, I see the potential for .meaningful to hold value.

Edwin said:
...If you need people to remember company.bikes it might be just as good to have them remember bikes.randomextension.

I disagree. This isn't about replicating the .com which really is a .random extension.

No matter if you are pro or against gTLDs let's consider for a moment if name.relevantTLD provides any benefit. Sure there are problems in awareness and readability as a website name (but when people stopped saying www. that also faced the same issue) but is there anything of benefit?

No matter which side you're on, surely "woops.bikes" vs "woopsbikes.com" has something going for it. I'm not saying that I prefer it over woopsbikes.com - because I don't. But, I can see that "woops.bikes" is potentially more memorable and it is more meaningful and it is more intimate and potentially more cutting edge - a talking point when you give out a business card.

Edwin said:
...In both cases you're counting on people going out of their comfort zone when it comes to recognising "this is a web address" so there's no extra merit to company.bikes over bikes.someotherextension...

People are definitely out of their comfort zones with gTLDs and that's another problem that can only be improved if some big sites break through with these TLDs.

But I see the merit as mentioned in my comment above your quote here. It's a talking point, and for those that become comfortable with these types of domains, they become the new awesome generics or prime domains to register and develop.

If people can remember a ten digit telephone number or even learn how to save it in their address books, I don't think learning word.word (+ other context clues) is a barrier. Add to that the possibility of search engine benefits down the line, I feel that some well run gTLDs deserve a look.

To make clear, I'm saying possibility, not likelihood.

Will word.word be enough to alert people it is a website they're dealing with?
Will websites first have to saw "www.name.gtld" or visit us at word.gtld?

Here's another thing I don't understand, why do people assume that .Net is better than any of the .gTLDs? or .Org? They may as well fall into the bucket of gTLDs? Also .org.uk and .me.uk where are they now? Does legacy really hold much value anymore?

No one has all the answers so who knows... will domains even be all that relevant? That's another debate with people using apps and typing a name in Google instead of into the address bar.

woopwoop · Mar 18, 2017

Edwin said:
If I were selling to a single market, I would choose a secondary cctld for that market way, way before something like .bikes.

So in the UK, bikes.org.uk would probably still serve a company 50x better than companyname.bikes would!

To each his own.

You would lose traffic to bikes.co.uk and bikes.com
People see that you have settled for a .org.uk
Even if you choose a .bikes because you are settling (unable to achieve a .com) you don't immediately look to have settled. In part of the process of understanding your business, some customers may see you as a pioneer, hip, trend setter.

Again it depends on the business. At the moment with no clear benefit for right of the dot words in SEO, if online is more essential than offline, if you can afford the .com or .co.uk of your dreams, then maybe stay away from .gtlds.

But equally, if you have budget you may want to be a real pioneer and increase your Adsense spend to get your woop.bikes name out there.

All about priorities, objectives...

dog · Mar 18, 2017

Yes, this thread was started because #6 price increase is a HUGE issue.

Frank Schilling created uncertainty. Do you really think sane people are going to recommend or promote new Gs now? Hell no. Why do you think GD pulled support for ALL Uniregistry TLDs?

https://www.acorndomains.co.uk/threads/godaddy-drops-uniregistry-domains.146176/

Any registry can raise prices at will and mark a premium after you register, even .NYC. So what is the motivation to recommend and use new TLDs?

Regarding #7, we are not "scared" of new Gs. We are trying to save newbies from a .MOBI disaster.

I own no .mobi names. If it were possible to own a negative number of domain names to further distance yourself from the name space, I would probably own “negative thousands”

-Frank Schilling

http://www.domainbits.com/mobi/

by @atlas

You realize Schilling is STILL buying f*ck tons of .com domains?

woopwoop said:
Erm, no. Here's the problem with new gTLDs:

They're late to the game and .com has had a 20+ year head start

People don't know about them

Companies are not widely using them

They're expensive in most cases

The gTLDs that are cheap have been taken over by spammers and scammers

The prices are not guaranteed to be stable which is a risk for investors and end users (this is what this thread should really be highlighting)

There is a group of people who fight against gTLDs because they are scared of the devaluation of their (in most cases crappy) .com portfolio.

Lucky Luke · Mar 18, 2017

I've just been to the Big Bang Science Fair at the NEC and saw a flyer for SpaceCareers.UK

The chap on the stand (UK Space Agency) said that a team of undergraduates had chosen the domain name.

Nice website too.

woopwoop · Mar 18, 2017

dog said:
Yes, this thread was started because #6 price increase is a HUGE issue....

Wait a second. So you want gTLDs to be successful? But you're against gTLDs aren't you?

dog said:
...Frank Schilling created uncertainty. Do you really think sane people are going to recommend or promote new Gs now?...

I think sane people don't flip flop three times in a thread. I also think sane people reflect and weigh up pros and cons, not shoot down a market or obfuscate with obvious hidden agenda.

dog said:
...Regarding #7, we are not "scared" of new Gs. We are trying to save newbies from a .MOBI disaster.

How are you trying to save them? Above you want them to be successful, even though you speak against them...

People will lose money. People will make money. The last two sentences are about domainers who by definition are risk takers so no need to protect them. As for the rest of the people if someone buys a .gtld and it doesn't work out then they haven't lost much. If it works out then they've gained.

I think that main thing is that the market needed this and there will be an adjustment. It will force registries who want to be seen as safe and responsible to establish rules for price hikes. Maybe ICANN will come up with rules. I'm sure that someone probably said this above in the thread - probably me.

dog · Mar 18, 2017

I've never flip flopped @/woopwoop. Your are trying to grasp at statements which don't exist here.

ICANN has shown they don't care about registrants. I am doubtful any registry wants to sign a price hike clause. If GD forced them, maybe?

Did you know TelNic is running out of funds?

https://www.acorndomains.co.uk/threads/tel-is-open.146261/

Yeah, regular people don't understand new Gs. Hard to keep track even for ****.

Edwin said:
Most people wouldn't even understand that company.bikes was meant to be a web address if they saw it on a flyer or the side of a van.

Most of these types of businesses will go with .com, .uk, .net, or even .org.

Edwin said:
Of course if you don't care about SEO or memorability or understandability then you can use whatever junk extension you like - and if you're just the local barber or plumber does it really matter?

Yup!

Edwin said:
But if you count on your domain name in any way, shape or form to actually help bring you business, you'd be wise not to deviate from the pattern I outlined above.

Again, there is no .bikes. There is a .bike.

And yes, it will hurt your business because people will type SuchSuchWhatever .com, co.uk, or maybe .uk.

Edwin said:
.bikes (or .whatever) isn't known in any country or territory. It doesn't fit the pattern. So it's perfectly usable for any business that doesn't care at all, but it's not going to win them business, and it will hurt them if they actually wanted traffic to come from people seeing the domain and typing it in.

.UK is a ccTLD, not a new domain extension.

Yeah, nice site. Wonder if more young people will choose .UK over .CO.UK?

Lucky Luke said:
I've just been to the Big Bang Science Fair at the NEC and saw a flyer for SpaceCareers.UK

The chap on the stand (UK Space Agency) said that a team of undergraduates had chosen the domain name.

Nice website too.