Bin Laden: Shoot To Kill

[BREWSTERS]

"Ten years after 9/11, the conspiracy theorist nutjobs are still telling lies"
http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/d...racy-theorist-nutjobs-are-still-telling-lies/

Make your mind up...'ignore' or 'nudge'? What's it going to be?

From that sanctimonious drivel you just posted;

"It’s surprising that the 7 World Trade Center building collapsed despite not being hit by a plane – surprising, that is, if you choose not to believe the structural engineers who discovered how uncontrolled fires caused support columns to collapse."

I choose not to believe. You know why? Because the engineers used for the official reports used incorrect temperatures for their models; incorrect structures in their models; and for the building to collapse the way it did would've needed for all support columns right around the (huge) building to collapse at exactly the same time. It would've been the only steel framed building in history to collapse through fire.
Structural steel is used for a particular reason - because it's strong and needs huge temperatures to effect it. Do you have a fireplace at home, or an oven? Will they not withstand hour after hour of direct heat without showing any signs of deterioration? How about 4 inch thick steel?

These are some of the reasons why I and any right-minded person doesn't believe that nonsense.

Tell me why I should believe it.

 

[mat]

I love how in one paragraph you state you won’t believe because they did not use correct models as a comparison, yet you then make a comparison to a household fireplace

 

[BREWSTERS]

One of my friends said something very apt about the whole thing:



To be honest, although it does matter what happened at 9/11, and it was a terrible disaster, the truth is no-one will ever know the truth. Ever.

With this in mind, I am tired of the whole thing and anyone that speaks about the whole thing as if they "know" exactly what happened. Which they don't.

The problem with all the conspiracies and conspiracy websites is that there has been 10 years of chinese wispers and fabrications of the truth with many people making a living out of selling "factual information" as they "were there".

Personally, I think it's time to let go and let those who lost family and friends in the disaster mourn their loss. Finally.

Rather than having to read, hear and see the same old regurgitated garbage year after year, with people pointing to the same old crappy conspiracy websites, articles and youtube videos, demanding the truth - but from who? And who are you to say anybody else is "wrong" just because it doesn't marry up to your shitty conspiracy websites?

I'm very open minded - I accepted what I saw and heard from the media for years. It's only once the official reports into the towers collapse came out and there were glaring discrepancies into how they came to their conclusions that my mind was changed. It's becoming obvious that the ones poo-pooing the evidence I'm laying out know extermely little about the whole thing.

Respect the dead. Let their families and friends remember the good times witht their loved ones. But most of all - remain respectful and hold your tongue, especially when you find yourself in the situation that not everybody agrees with you and all of your "sound knowledge" of the traggic event and your opinions that are heavily based on so many "facts" (but based more on opinions).

Again:

The reason is, it matters. 911 changed the world and except for a very few, it changed for much the worse.

Do we still not search for Nazi war criminals? Are we not prosecuting people for Serbian war crimes? Are our troups not being killed regularly on the back of all this BS? The respectful thing to do is search for justice for those who have lost their lives either directly 10 years ago, or indirectly today.

 

[anthony]

I've shown you plenty that you choose to disregard - I think it's time you guys showed me something in return.

http://history1900s.about.com/od/1940s/a/empirecrash.htm

Only in your mind do you think you are proving things. The only proof of a conspiracy is to show us the evidence of the perps carrying it out, something we all know you will never be able to do, any more than all the other doubters can. That's because this was a terrorist act, pure and simple. Instead you keep falling back on your pool of different links and conjecture.

You're in the minority on this matter here for blindingly obvious reasons, you're wrong. You'll be telling us you have a '9/11 Was A Conspiracy' t-shirt next!

 

[BREWSTERS]

I love how in one paragraph you state you won’t believe because they did not use correct models as a comparison, yet you then make a comparison to a household fireplace

The comparison is valid - you can burn coal or whatever on your fire for days on end with no damage, yet you wish to believe that 4 inch thick steel would be compromised after a few hours at similar temeratures.

Does that sound plausible to you? Because it isn't - it just isn't.

 

[mat]

The funniest thing about this is that people like Brewsters are being taken for a bigger ride by "media" and they don’t even realise it.

 

[BREWSTERS]

Only in your mind do you think you are proving things.

Only in fact! The official story on how the towers collapsed used false data. I've shown you that. Using the correct data proves that their theory is wrong. Why can't you understand that. It's there for you to see. There are thousands of architects and engineers who have put their names to the fact the offical story is wrong.

The only proof of a conspiracy is to show us the evidence of the perps carrying it out, something we all know you will never be able to do, any more than all the other doubters can. That's because this was a terrorist act, pure and simple. Instead you keep falling back on your pool of different links and conjecture.

If you find someones body with 50 bullet holes in it, do you need to find the shooter before you know there's been a murder?
You're clutching at this one line to try and prove yourself right because you know I cannot name names - I've stated twice that I don't know holds real power but I would start with a group of miltary guys, politicos, and those profiting from the 'war on terror'.

You're in the minority on this matter here for blindingly obvious reasons, you're wrong. You'll be telling us you have a '9/11 Was A Conspiracy' t-shirt next!

It is obvious that I'm in the minority here. And I'm amazed at the level of ignorance on the subject from those so vocal at dismissing the evidence.

 

[BREWSTERS]

The funniest thing about this is that people like Brewsters are being taken for a bigger ride by "media" and they don’t even realise it.

Mat, that's your opinion but you haven't offered anything factual to back it up.

We're now on page 18, and not one of you have come forward with a fact that you say proves to you the official story.

I'm going out with the wife and kids now...maybe one of you will man up and have the power of your convictions to post that fact by the time I get back?

 

[anthony]

There are thousands of architects and engineers who have put their names to the fact the offical story is wrong...

Engineers and architects design and built lots of shit that fails (the Tacoma Bridge), or is unstable (the Millenium Bridge), or is supposedly earthquake proof (100's of building have collapsed in that category), so this stance is weak from the start.

I prefer hard evidence of conspirators (that's why I keep banging on about it) because there hasn't been a conspiracy in the history of man that didn't leave a trace. Face it, Brewster, you've been taken in mate!

 

[domainseller200]

 

[binny]

Any engineering technique is only as good as the application, I honestly believe these architects are baffled because they work with ideas and paper and they don't realise their instructions get twisted and diluted or even ommitted. How good were construction inspection standards in New York when the buildings were erected?

An engineer will tell you that a zinc coated bolt will be protected from corrosion but a single crack in that zinc coating creates a vulnerability to corrosion. On paper the engineering techniques used in the design may have made the building strong enough to withstand a plane impact but were they correctly applied?

Did the architects take into account what would happen in the event of a plane impact if the bulding had internal corrosion or did they conduct the calculations for a fresh new building? I would suggest that they conducted the calculations for a fresh new building because thats how architects worked then and continued to work until recently. The introduction of the CDM regulations in the UK in the 90's and updating a few years ago was necessary because architects didn't really worry about what happened once the ribbon was cut. How much of what we know now about the hazards of aluminium were known at the time of the building's design?

The conspiracy stories make interesting reading but at the end of the day they're just that.....conspiracy stories. Sometimes arse-covering by people who could or should have seen an event coming will cloud the issue and make a conspiracy story slightly more believable but thats about as close to the truth they get.

 

[BREWSTERS]

Engineers and architects design and built lots of shit that fails (the Tacoma Bridge), or is unstable (the Millenium Bridge), or is supposedly earthquake proof (100's of building have collapsed in that category), so this stance is weak from the start.

But you will happily agree with the ones who compiled the reports...with false data. Bizarre.

I prefer hard evidence of conspirators (that's why I keep banging on about it) because there hasn't been a conspiracy in the history of man that didn't leave a trace.

How would you know? If it hadn't left a trace, you wouldn't know would you.

And there are plenty of traces with this case.

A few people here wanted to say something: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bvay28lZiHU

How many others have been killed trying to get the story out. These people never got any mainstream coverage. There is documented evidence that firefighters were told not to talk about bombs after the event - luckily there is plenty of live video from the day when they talk of explosions going right round the building, 'bang, bang, bang, bang, bang'.
You say there are no traces - you're just unaware of them.

Face it, Brewster, you've been taken in mate!

Actually, you have been. A day ago you believed that the structural strength in the towers came from the outer walls. I showed that to be completely wrong, and yet that hasn't altered your belief in any way.

 

[mat]

Brewsters, just out of curiosity what is your experience, education, relation to any of the fields involved in this subject? Have you worked in or studied any of the areas involved?

 

[GreyWing]

How many others have been killed trying to get the story out. These people never got any mainstream coverage.

lol, the plot has well and truly been lost now. If they never got the mainstream coverage why bother to kill them?

If they were killing people like that, why has David Shayler walking the streets for the last 10 years?

I hope this thread doesn't get locked or deleted because you'll start a rumour that Admin is a CIA agent.

 

[edo]

I have to say I'm honoured that my humble post about the C4 program has resulted in this many replies...

...even if most of them are straight from the lunatic asylum :wink:

Ed

 

[BREWSTERS]

Brewsters, just out of curiosity what is your experience, education, relation to any of the fields involved in this subject? Have you worked in or studied any of the areas involved?

Do I need to be an engineer, metalugist, architect or pilot to be able to see that that if they use figures that are wrong, they will get a result that is wrong?

I'm no doctor either but I know that hitting my hand with a hammer will result in pain, possible fractures, bruising and discomfort - how do I know that?

 

[cam220903]

m

 

[BREWSTERS]

lol, the plot has well and truly been lost now. If they never got the mainstream coverage why bother to kill them?

If you'd bothered to watch it, you'd see that in some cases they were about to get mainstream coverage. The woman who supposedly hung herself the day before she was to testify in court naming someones involvement in 911. The same woman laughed off the question of suicide just the day before. Dr David Kelly stylee.

If they were killing people like that, why has David Shayler walking the streets for the last 10 years?

David Shayler, phft...for what he knew it wasn't worth a bullet!

I hope this thread doesn't get locked or deleted because you'll start a rumour that Admin is a CIA agent.

 

[BREWSTERS]

I have to say I'm honoured that my humble post about the C4 program has resulted in this many replies...

...even if most of them are straight from the lunatic asylum :wink:

Ed

Why's that? Is it amongst your greatest achievements?

 

[retired_member33]

Yep those dam yanks going about their daily lives, doing a job to feed their kids, burn alive a-holes



I see your point now, the world could have been a lot better if they hadn't help clear the Germans out of your country by sacrificing their young.

As far as I know places like Holland weren't swimming in oil or cash in the 1940's, only tulips and forgive me but we haven't had a run on Tulips since the mid 1600's.

Not even going to answer this one as I guess that my answer will result in a ban.