A reality check needed on domain prices?

[donreeco]

Great idea. We could move these posts into it
http://www.acorndomains.co.uk/uk-expired-domain-names-drop-lists/70254-all-sorts-availables.html
http://www.acorndomains.co.uk/uk-expired-domain-names-drop-lists/70441-all-sorts-availables-2-a.html
http://www.acorndomains.co.uk/uk-expired-domain-names-drop-lists/70637-all-sorts-availables-3-a.html
http://www.acorndomains.co.uk/uk-expired-domain-names-drop-lists/71703-all-sorts-availables-4-a.html
http://www.acorndomains.co.uk/uk-ex...ists/46961-huge-list-over-500-availables.html

To get back to the original post...

Would you consider any of the those name to be "commercially useful"? I am just thinking that if I had just registered a similar name for £x, I might be quite happy to then sell it to someone on here for £xx or £xxx. That person could be legitimately working on behalf of a "client", who was on a tight budget. The deal would work for everyone. Would you see this doing both the "client" and the domaining community a disservice?

 

[retired_member13]

I do think that it is possible to buy commercially useful names on the aftermarket for under £100, and it's also still possible to hand reg them for £6 - just not in every market.

For me it depends on what the nature of the market is - if you're in the debt business you'd struggle to get a good name for that price, but if you own a company that manufactures branded keyrings then the .co.uk name is still sat there unregistered.

Personally I don't have an issue with people using "clients" and "cheap" in the same sentence, and I'd have thought that the glass half full view is that the fact that people outside of the domaining world want to buy aftermarket domain names at all is a good thing - at least then the only remaining objection to overcome is that of price?

 

[rob]

Forget the wider 'community' which as a term is frankly laughable. I'm in it for me and me alone. Every single person on this board is a business 'enemy' of mine, as indeed I am to some others. It doesn't mean i have to belittle others actions or methods.

Lets just get on with our own separate agendas and models and keep plugging away.

Thats the difference - your registrations and actions can affect my business.

That then is my business

eg. Rich Schwartz who makes out he represents domaining told the upstream manager of the domain channel from google to F-off and has a barney.

That is the business of every domain owner who makes £ from google.


In terms of UK the most obvious one is say people regging madaline mccan domains to park or dodgy TMs that end up with a tighter DRS.

 

[retired_member16]

Thats the difference - your registrations and actions can affect my business.

That then is my business
.

I won't lose any sleep ;-)

 

[domainking]

That then is my business

In terms of UK the most obvious one is say people regging madaline mccan domains to park or dodgy TMs that end up with a tighter DRS.[/QUOTE

That should be Nominets business not the end users, or wholesalers,
and nominet allows you to register any .co.uk term as long as it makes the money. maybe when you where in the PAB you should have applied to get some sort code or morals put in place with Nominet.

What happened to the PAB why was it disbaned.

 

[GreyWing]

People like Rob and Andrew Bennett who devoted their time to the PAB are the real guys who have helped out the .uk market and not so they could flog their own stuff. They did it all behind the scenes and took knocks for it along the way.

Big mistake to ever disband it, however people weren't standing for it either.

 

[rob]

That then is my business

In terms of UK the most obvious one is say people regging madaline mccan domains to park or dodgy TMs that end up with a tighter DRS.

That should be Nominets business not the end users, or wholesalers,
and nominet allows you to register any .co.uk term as long as it makes the money. maybe when you where in the PAB you should have applied to get some sort code or morals put in place with Nominet.

What happened to the PAB why was it disbaned.

[/quote]

Thing is Nominet's ear is being bent by not just domainers but TM holders , registrants, small and large business, legal types etc etc etc.

I think myself and others did a fair job when on the PAB, and before and after it.

The silence from others was and is deafening , and the actions by some before and during that time ensured any step taken forward was swiftly followed by one taken backward.

PAB was replaced with http://www.nominet.org.uk/policy/process/ , and thanks to one or two people (myself included) pushing for it there is an oversight comittee so there is at least some kind of 'independant' oversight.


There is an active issue group probably of interest to people on here http://www.nominet.org.uk/policy/issuegroups/current/expireddomaintasting/ but not seen it mentioned anywhere yet.

Should a registrar be able to take control of a registrant's domain name when it has expired and monetize or ‘taste’ the traffic on the domain name? Who is affected by this practice and is it detrimental to registrants and other stakeholders? by one A Bennett.

You just have to look on Acorn to see the people who kick off and get very vocal when policy changes affect them, yet dont give a toss or create problems themselves either side of it.

 

[BREWSTERS]

Ok. This is a birds eye view of this thread.

Edwin doesn't want anyone posting domains wanted 'on behalf of a client' for what he sees as low values. Reason given - it 'undervalues' domains. Reading into that, it would seem that he would prefer everyone to price according to his own model, thereby making his own domains appear to be priced similar to the competition.

My view of this. The person requesting the domains is a reseller. As a reseller they are expected to price the domain to their client (end user) accordingly. They cannot be expected to buy at end user levels.
I have never posted a wanted ad on AD , but I have on other forums. When a potential customer has asked for a domain for a specific purpose, first thing I do is check what's available to register. Once I have those options the next thing is check what's available on the drop in the near future. Third, I might post a wanted ad to find out what's out there at reseller price.

Why would anyone go to the bother of posting in the wanted section at end user prices unless they themselves were the end user?

 

[Edwin]

Edwin doesn't want anyone posting domains wanted 'on behalf of a client' for what he sees as low values. Reason given - it 'undervalues' domains. Reading into that, it would seem that he would prefer everyone to price according to his own model, thereby making his own domains appear to be priced similar to the competition.

That's quite a mis-reading! That would be like asking for the sea to be drained because I can't swim!

No, my original post has absolutely nothing with trying to raise "average industry prices". It was a very narrow, specific comment and there's no hidden agenda, ulterior motive or anything whatsoever to be read between the lines. If there was, I'd have come right out and said it - I'm not known for my subtlety!

 

[foz]

Although not a definitive reference, Sedo in the past year has put the median sale price between £335 to £553 for a .co.uk domain.

So for me, its a reasonable request to stipulate a budget of low £xxx for a .co.uk domain (£200-£300).

The experience I have had with agencies and web design companies is that they prefer to to extract as much £££ out of their client in billing time, not to encourage high value domain name sales. If their was a commission in it for them then that would be a different matter, cooperation and enthusiasm would be abundant.

 

[julian]

i'm incline to agree - and to be frank (no pun intended) I respect the fact you've been around for a long time - but you are full of sanctimonious shit sometimes Edwin - you've bought hand reg's off me for £20 and priced them up for 2k list five mins later...? - i'm making you rich by my account

You can't educate a client who doesn't understand it.

You bat for both sides of the team Edwin, as you are the first person to show off your lists of 100's of daily hand regged domains for £x which you then proceed to price up as £x,xxx within seconds of aquiring them

So surely your statement which says "I think you're doing both your "client" and the domaining community a disservice if you nod along and agree with them that it's realistic to expect to find a commercially useful domain name for £xx" could also also applied to your hand regged names

So either there ARE commercially useful domain names for available £x or £xx or every name you are hand regging youself is a pile of rubbish.

You can't have it both ways.

Picked up cosmeticveneers.co.uk for £20 a few weeks back from here - would you say that was a crap buy for £20 ?

I am not saying you are 100% wrong in what you are saying, but as Greywing says just because everyone doesn't use your business model doesn't mean they are wrong.

 

[cm1975]

Ok. This is a birds eye view of this thread.

Edwin doesn't want anyone posting domains wanted 'on behalf of a client' for what he sees as low values. Reason given - it 'undervalues' domains. Reading into that, it would seem that he would prefer everyone to price according to his own model, thereby making his own domains appear to be priced similar to the competition.

My view of this. The person requesting the domains is a reseller. As a reseller they are expected to price the domain to their client (end user) accordingly. They cannot be expected to buy at end user levels.
I have never posted a wanted ad on AD , but I have on other forums. When a potential customer has asked for a domain for a specific purpose, first thing I do is check what's available to register. Once I have those options the next thing is check what's available on the drop in the near future. Third, I might post a wanted ad to find out what's out there at reseller price.

Why would anyone go to the bother of posting in the wanted section at end user prices unless they themselves were the end user?

I don't think that's what Edwin is saying.

I believe Edwin is suggesting that people should educate their clients into spending a larger proportion of their budget on better keyword domains, thus saving them money they would otherwise have to spend on SEO work, Adwords or advertising to promote the domain.

The results in Google ranking may be the same, but the better domain may prove cheaper in the longer term.

For example, should an insurance company buy insurance.co.uk or buy newbrandname.co.uk. Yes insurance.co.uk would be more expensive, but the latter will take a hell of a lot more money to market & promote, and may prove more expensive in the longer term.

Yes you can get bargains on AD, as not everyone is looking to make 10,000% profit on every domain, but maybe pushing the budget above £x or £xx may prove more beneficial for the end user.

However, there are some clients that just need a very average domain at a very low cost. ie. Joe Bloggs the plumber can't afford to spend £xxx on a domain name.

Whether you agree with Edwin's pricing model doesn't really matter.

 

[domainking]

Thing is Nominet's ear is being bent by not just domainers but TM holders , registrants, small and large business, legal types etc etc etc.

I think myself and others did a fair job when on the PAB, and before and after it.

.[/QUOTE]

Thanks for the info Rob its aways good to see there is some people doing a good job on the Nominet front instead of using it for self promotion and gain.

 

[davedevelopment]

I believe Edwin is suggesting that people should educate their clients into spending a larger proportion of their budget on better keyword domains, thus saving them money they would otherwise have to spend on SEO work, Adwords or advertising to promote the domain.

I understand that part, but then having educated them, and they still only want to spend or have to spend £xxx, should I just not bother posting a wanted advert? Should I post a disclaimer saying "yes, I know it's a small budget and have lowered my clients expectations"?

While I personally would try and educate the client and lower their expectations, I don't see why I need to tell anyone else if you catch my drift?

 

[cm1975]

I understand that part, but then having educated them, and they still only want to spend or have to spend £xxx, should I just not bother posting a wanted advert? Should I post a disclaimer saying "yes, I know it's a small budget and have lowered my clients expectations"?

My post was more an interpretation of Edwin's original post, which does make sense. However, I can see both sides of the argument. You can take a horse to water. Some people have the short term view and no matter how much you tell them, they will not change their mind.

Also, there are always going to be people would can only afford to pay £xx for a domain name. For example, Joe Bloggs the plumber (the client) does not have the cashflow to justify paying more than that for a domain name and just wants something to write on the side of his van!

While I personally would try and educate the client and lower their expectations, I don't see why I need to tell anyone else if you catch my drift?

I catch your drift! However, this forum is here for such discussions and it would be a far less interesting place if people did not share their views and ideas (within reason of course!)

 

[BREWSTERS]

That's quite a mis-reading! That would be like asking for the sea to be drained because I can't swim!

No, my original post has absolutely nothing with trying to raise "average industry prices". It was a very narrow, specific comment and there's no hidden agenda, ulterior motive or anything whatsoever to be read between the lines. If there was, I'd have come right out and said it - I'm not known for my subtlety!

Ok.

So what is the difference with someone buying a domain for £xx on here, and then selling it to their end user customer for £2k - and your good self registering a domain for £x and selling it to your end user customer for £2k?

 

[pugyrob]

Ok.

So what is the difference with someone buying a domain for £xx on here, and then selling it to their end user customer for £2k - and your good self registering a domain for £x and selling it to your end user customer for £2k?

Best point so far well made. Half the people probably aren't buying for a client anyway but it makes the negotiating easier if it's seemingly for a third party.